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The Double Indictment (21-25)

urn:cts:greekLit:tlg0062.tlg026.perseus-eng2:21-25
Refs {'start': {'reference': '21', 'human_reference': 'Section 21'}, 'end': {'reference': '25', 'human_reference': 'Section 25'}}
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EPICURUS

I shall not address you at length, gentlemen of the jury, for I myself do not need many words. If Pleasure had used charms or philtres to constrain Dionysius, whom Stoa claims to be her lover, to desert Stoa and to centre his regard upon her, she might fairly have been held a sorceress and might have been found guilty of using undue influence upon the lovers of others. But suppose a free man in a free city, unstopped by the laws, hating the tedium of life with her and thinking that the happiness which comes, she says, as the consummation of pain is stuff and nonsense, made his escape from her thorny, labyrinthine reasonings and ran away to Pleasure of his own free will, cutting the meshes of

v.3.p.127
her logic as if they weré bonds, because he had the spirit of a human being, not of a clod, and thought pain painful, as indeed it is, and pleasure pleasant, in that case would it have been right to bar him out, plunging him head over ears into a sea of pain when he was swimming from a wreck to a haven and yearned for calm waterto put the poor fellow at the mercy of her dilemmas in spite of the fact that he was seeking asylum with Pleasure like a suppliant at the Altar of Mercyin order that he might climb the steep with copious sweat, cast eyes upon that famous Virtue,[*] and then, after toiling painfully his whole life long, be happy when life is over?

Who should be considered a better judge than this man himself, who knew the teachings of Stoa if ever a man did, and formerly thought that only what was right was good, but now has learnt that pain is bad, and so has chosen what he has determined to be the better? He saw, no doubt, that her set make a great deal of talk about fortitude and endurance of pain, but privately pay court to Pleasure; that they are bold as brass in the lecture-room, but live under the laws of Pleasure at home; that they are ashamed, of course, to let themselves be seen lowering their pitch and playing false to their tenets, but suffer the tortures of Tantalus, poor fellows, so that wherever they think they will be unobserved and can transgress their laws with safety, they eagerly glut themselves with pleasure. In fact, if they should be given the ring of Gyges, so that they could put it on and be unseen, or the Cap of Darkness, without a doubt they would bid good-bye

v.3.p.129
to pain for ever and would go crowding after Pleasure, one and all, imitating Dionysius who, until he was ill, expected to get some benefit from their discourses about fortitude, but when he encountered suffering and illness, and pain came closer home to him, he perceived that his body was contradicting Stoa and maintaining the opposite side. So he put more trust in it than in her set, decided that he was aman, with the body of a man, and thenceforward treated it otherwise than as if it were a statue, well. aware that whoever maintains any other view and accuses Pleasure
Doth like to talk, but thinks as others do!
Euripides, Phoenissae360. I have done. Cast your ballots with this understanding of the case.

STOA

No, no! Let me cross-question him a little.

EPICURUS

Put your questions: I will answer them.

STOA

Do you consider pain bad?

EPICURUS

Yes.

STOA

And pleasure good?

EPICURUS

Certainly.

STOA

Well, do you know the meaning of material and immaterial,” of approved and disapproved”?[*]

v.3.p.131
EPICURUS

Certainly.

HERMES

Stoa, the jurors say they cant understand these dissyllabic questions, so be silent; they are voting.

STOA

I should have won if I had put him a question in the form of the third indemonstrable.”[*]

JUSTICE

Who won?

HERMES

Pleasure, unanimously.

STOA

I appeal to Zeus!

JUSTICE

Good luck to you! Hermes, call another case.

HERMES

Virtue v. High-living, im re Aristippus. Let Aristippus appear in person.

VIRTUE

I ought to speak first; I am Virtue, and Aristippus belongs to me, as his words and his deeds indicate. HIGH-LIVING No, indeed; I ought to speak first; I am High-living, and the man is mine, as you can see from his garlands, his purple cloak and his perfumes.

v.3.p.133
JUSTICE

Do not wrangle; this case will stand over until Zeus decides the case of Dionysius, for this seems to be similar. Consequently, if Pleasure wins, Highliving shall have Aristippus, but if Stoa prevails, he shall be adjudged to Virtue. So let others appear. Look here, thoughthese jurors are not to get the fee, for their case has not come to trial.

HERMES

Then are they to have come up here for nothing, old as they are, and the hill so high?

JUSTICE

It will be enough if they get a third. Go your ways; dont be angry, you shall serve another day.

HERMES

It is time for Diogenes of Sinope to appear. Make your complaint, Banking.

DIOGENES

I protest, if she does not stop bothering me, Justice, it will not be running away that she will have me up for, but aggravated assault and battery, for I shall mighty soon.take my staff and. .. .

JUSTICE

What have we here? Banking has run away, and he is making after her with his stick raised. The poor creature is likely to catch it pretty badly! Call Pyrrho,

v.3.p.135

HERMES

Painting is here, Justice, but Pyrrho has not come up at all. It might have been expected that he would do this.

JUSTICE

Why, Hermes?

HERMES

Because he does not believe there is any true standard of judgment.

JUSTICE

Then let them bring in a verdict by default against him. Now call the speech-writer, the Syrian. After all, it was only recently that the writs were lodged against him, and there was no pressing need to have tried the cases now. However, since that point has been decided, introduce the suit of Oratory first. Heavens, what a crowd has come together for the hearing!

HERMES

Naturally, Justice. The case is not stale, but new and unfamiliar, having been entered only yesterday, as you said, and they hope to hear Oratory and Dialogue bringing charges in turn and the Syrian defending himself against both; this has brought crowds to court. But do begin your speech, Oratory.

Tokens

EPICURUS 1 w 8
I 2 w 9
shall 1 w 14
not 1 w 17
address 1 w 24
you 1 w 27
at 1 w 29
length 1 w 35
gentlemen 1 w 45
of 1 w 47
the 1 w 50
jury 1 w 54
for 1 w 58
I 3 w 59
myself 1 w 65
do 1 w 67
not 2 w 70
need 1 w 74
many 1 w 78
words 1 w 83
If 1 w 86
Pleasure 1 w 94
had 1 w 97
used 1 w 101
charms 1 w 107
or 3 w 109
philtres 1 w 117
to 1 w 119
constrain 1 w 128
Dionysius 1 w 137
whom 1 w 142
Stoa 1 w 146
claims 1 w 152
to 3 w 154
be 1 w 156
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lover 1 w 164
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desert 1 w 173
Stoa 2 w 177
and 1 w 180
to 6 w 182
centre 1 w 188
his 1 w 191
regard 1 w 197
upon 1 w 201
her 2 w 204
she 1 w 208
might 1 w 213
fairly 1 w 219
have 1 w 223
been 1 w 227
held 1 w 231
a 16 w 232
sorceress 1 w 241
and 2 w 244
might 2 w 249
have 2 w 253
been 2 w 257
found 1 w 262
guilty 1 w 268
of 2 w 270
using 1 w 275
undue 1 w 280
influence 1 w 289
upon 2 w 293
the 2 w 296
lovers 1 w 302
of 3 w 304
others 1 w 310
But 1 w 314
suppose 1 w 321
a 19 w 322
free 1 w 326
man 2 w 329
in 4 w 331
a 21 w 332
free 2 w 336
city 1 w 340
unstopped 1 w 350
by 1 w 352
the 4 w 355
laws 1 w 359
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the 5 w 369
tedium 1 w 375
of 4 w 377
life 1 w 381
with 1 w 385
her 4 w 388
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that 1 w 403
the 6 w 406
happiness 1 w 415
which 1 w 420
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as 2 w 436
the 7 w 439
consummation 1 w 451
of 5 w 453
pain 1 w 457
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stuff 1 w 464
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nonsense 1 w 475
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escape 1 w 489
from 1 w 493
her 5 w 496
thorny 1 w 502
labyrinthine 1 w 515
reasonings 1 w 525
and 5 w 528
ran 1 w 531
away 1 w 535
to 8 w 537
Pleasure 2 w 545
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his 3 w 550
own 1 w 553
free 3 w 557
will 1 w 561
cutting 1 w 569
the 8 w 572
meshes 1 w 578
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logic 1 w 588
as 5 w 590
if 2 w 592
they 1 w 596
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bonds 1 w 605
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spirit 1 w 627
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a 44 w 630
human 1 w 635
being 1 w 640
not 3 w 644
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a 46 w 647
clod 1 w 651
and 6 w 655
thought 1 w 662
pain 2 w 666
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as 6 w 676
indeed 1 w 682
it 4 w 684
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and 7 w 690
pleasure 1 w 698
pleasant 1 w 706
in 18 w 709
that 2 w 713
case 1 w 717
would 1 w 722
it 5 w 724
have 3 w 728
been 3 w 732
right 1 w 737
to 9 w 739
bar 1 w 742
him 1 w 745
out 1 w 748
plunging 1 w 757
him 2 w 760
head 1 w 764
over 3 w 768
ears 1 w 772
into 1 w 776
a 61 w 777
sea 1 w 780
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pain 4 w 786
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a 65 w 808
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a 66 w 816
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and 8 w 824
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put 1 w 849
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fellow 1 w 862
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the 12 w 867
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in 23 w 887
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the 13 w 897
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that 3 w 905
he 28 w 907
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seeking 1 w 917
asylum 1 w 923
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Pleasure 3 w 935
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a 79 w 940
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the 14 w 954
Altar 1 w 959
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Mercy 1 w 966
in 25 w 969
order 1 w 974
that 4 w 978
he 30 w 980
might 3 w 985
climb 1 w 990
the 15 w 994
steep 1 w 999
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copious 1 w 1011
sweat 1 w 1016
cast 1 w 1021
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that 5 w 1033
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For 1 w 1049
the 16 w 1052
Hill 1 w 1056
of 14 w 1058
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see 2 w 1068
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and 9 w 1083
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289 1 w 1091
ff 2 w 1093
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Simonides 1 w 1107
41 1 w 1110
and 11 w 1114
then 1 w 1118
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his 4 w 1143
whole 1 w 1148
life 2 w 1152
long 1 w 1156
be 7 w 1159
happy 1 w 1164
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life 3 w 1172
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over 4 w 1178
Who 1 w 1182
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considered 1 w 1200
a 95 w 1201
better 1 w 1207
judge 1 w 1212
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this 1 w 1220
man 4 w 1223
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Stoa 3 w 1256
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ever 1 w 1262
a 100 w 1263
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pain 6 w 1339
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bad 1 w 1344
and 13 w 1348
so 3 w 1350
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what 2 w 1363
he 36 w 1365
has 3 w 1368
determined 1 w 1378
to 15 w 1380
be 10 w 1382
the 19 w 1385
better 2 w 1391
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saw 1 w 1397
no 6 w 1400
doubt 1 w 1405
that 8 w 1410
her 8 w 1413
set 1 w 1416
make 1 w 1420
a 119 w 1421
great 1 w 1426
deal 1 w 1430
of 16 w 1432
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about 1 w 1441
fortitude 1 w 1450
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endurance 1 w 1462
of 17 w 1464
pain 7 w 1468
but 2 w 1472
privately 1 w 1481
pay 1 w 1484
court 1 w 1489
to 16 w 1491
Pleasure 4 w 1499
that 9 w 1504
they 2 w 1508
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bold 1 w 1515
as 22 w 1517
brass 1 w 1522
in 32 w 1524
the 21 w 1527
lecture-room 1 w 1539
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the 22 w 1555
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of 18 w 1561
Pleasure 5 w 1569
at 21 w 1571
home 1 w 1575
that 10 w 1580
they 3 w 1584
are 2 w 1587
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of 19 w 1597
course 1 w 1603
to 17 w 1606
let 1 w 1609
themselves 1 w 1619
be 12 w 1621
seen 1 w 1625
lowering 1 w 1634
their 1 w 1639
pitch 1 w 1644
and 15 w 1648
playing 1 w 1655
false 1 w 1660
to 18 w 1662
their 2 w 1667
tenets 1 w 1673
but 4 w 1677
suffer 1 w 1683
the 27 w 1686
tortures 1 w 1694
of 20 w 1696
Tantalus 1 w 1704
poor 2 w 1709
fellows 1 w 1716
so 4 w 1719
that 11 w 1723
wherever 1 w 1731
they 4 w 1735
think 2 w 1740
they 5 w 1744
will 2 w 1748
be 13 w 1750
unobserved 1 w 1760
and 16 w 1763
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transgress 1 w 1776
their 3 w 1781
laws 3 w 1785
with 4 w 1789
safety 1 w 1795
they 6 w 1800
eagerly 1 w 1807
glut 1 w 1811
themselves 2 w 1821
with 5 w 1825
pleasure 2 w 1833
In 1 w 1836
fact 2 w 1840
if 6 w 1843
they 7 w 1847
should 2 w 1853
be 14 w 1855
given 1 w 1860
the 34 w 1863
ring 2 w 1867
of 21 w 1869
Gyges 1 w 1874
so 5 w 1877
that 12 w 1881
they 8 w 1885
could 1 w 1890
put 2 w 1893
it 13 w 1895
on 15 w 1897
and 17 w 1900
be 15 w 1902
unseen 1 w 1908
or 15 w 1911
the 36 w 1914
Cap 1 w 1917
of 22 w 1919
Darkness 1 w 1927
without 1 w 1935
a 159 w 1936
doubt 2 w 1941
they 9 w 1945
would 2 w 1950
bid 1 w 1953
good-bye 1 w 1961
to 20 w 1963
pain 8 w 1967
for 5 w 1970
ever 3 w 1974
and 18 w 1977
would 3 w 1982
go 3 w 1984
crowding 1 w 1992
after 2 w 1997
Pleasure 6 w 2005
one 1 w 2009
and 19 w 2012
all 2 w 2015
imitating 1 w 2025
Dionysius 2 w 2034
who 4 w 2037
until 1 w 2043
he 58 w 2045
was 5 w 2048
ill 4 w 2051
expected 1 w 2060
to 21 w 2062
get 1 w 2065
some 1 w 2069
benefit 1 w 2076
from 3 w 2080
their 4 w 2085
discourses 1 w 2095
about 2 w 2100
fortitude 2 w 2109
but 5 w 2113
when 3 w 2117
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encountered 1 w 2130
suffering 1 w 2139
and 20 w 2142
illness 1 w 2149
and 21 w 2153
pain 9 w 2157
came 1 w 2161
closer 1 w 2167
home 2 w 2171
to 22 w 2173
him 4 w 2176
he 62 w 2179
perceived 1 w 2188
that 13 w 2192
his 6 w 2195
body 1 w 2199
was 6 w 2202
contradicting 1 w 2215
Stoa 4 w 2219
and 22 w 2222
maintaining 1 w 2233
the 39 w 2236
opposite 1 w 2244
side 2 w 2248
So 1 w 2251
he 64 w 2253
put 3 w 2256
more 1 w 2260
trust 1 w 2265
in 46 w 2267
it 19 w 2269
than 2 w 2273
in 47 w 2275
her 10 w 2278
set 2 w 2281
decided 1 w 2289
that 14 w 2293
he 66 w 2295
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aman 1 w 2303
with 7 w 2308
the 40 w 2311
body 2 w 2315
of 23 w 2317
a 185 w 2318
man 7 w 2321
and 23 w 2325
thenceforward 1 w 2338
treated 1 w 2345
it 21 w 2347
otherwise 1 w 2356
than 3 w 2360
as 31 w 2362
if 7 w 2364
it 22 w 2366
were 1 w 2370
a 192 w 2371
statue 1 w 2377
well 1 w 2382
aware 1 w 2388
that 15 w 2392
whoever 1 w 2399
maintains 1 w 2408
any 2 w 2411
other 3 w 2416
view 1 w 2420
and 24 w 2423
accuses 1 w 2430
Pleasure 7 w 2438
Doth 1 w 2442
like 2 w 2446
to 24 w 2448
talk 2 w 2452
but 6 w 2456
thinks 1 w 2462
as 33 w 2464
others 2 w 2470
do 4 w 2472
Euripides 1 w 2482
Phoenissae360 1 w 2496
I 6 w 2498
have 5 w 2502
done 1 w 2506
Cast 1 w 2511
your 1 w 2515
ballots 1 w 2522
with 8 w 2526
this 2 w 2530
understanding 1 w 2543
of 24 w 2545
the 45 w 2548
case 2 w 2552
STOA 1 w 2557
No 1 w 2559
no 8 w 2562
Let 1 w 2566
me 11 w 2568
cross-question 1 w 2582
him 5 w 2585
a 211 w 2586
little 1 w 2592
EPICURUS 2 w 2601
Put 1 w 2604
your 2 w 2608
questions 1 w 2617
I 8 w 2619
will 3 w 2623
answer 1 w 2629
them 3 w 2633
STOA 2 w 2638
Do 2 w 2640
you 4 w 2643
consider 2 w 2651
pain 10 w 2655
bad 2 w 2658
EPICURUS 3 w 2667
Yes 1 w 2670
STOA 3 w 2675
And 1 w 2678
pleasure 3 w 2686
good 3 w 2690
EPICURUS 4 w 2699
Certainly 1 w 2708
STOA 4 w 2713
Well 1 w 2717
do 6 w 2720
you 5 w 2723
know 1 w 2727
the 47 w 2730
meaning 1 w 2737
of 25 w 2739
material 1 w 2748
and 26 w 2752
immaterial 1 w 2763
of 26 w 2767
approved 1 w 2776
and 27 w 2780
disapproved 1 w 2792
Stoic 1 w 2799
technical 1 w 2808
terms 1 w 2813
see 5 w 2817
vol 1 w 2820
ii 1 w 2823
p 54 w 2825
488 1 w 2829
Stoa 5 w 2834
intends 1 w 2841
to 27 w 2843
prove 3 w 2848
that 16 w 2852
pleasure 4 w 2860
and 28 w 2863
pain 11 w 2867
are 4 w 2870
alike 1 w 2875
immaterial 2 w 2886
and 29 w 2891
neither 1 w 2898
approved 3 w 2907
nor 1 w 2911
disapproved 2 w 2923
because 2 w 2932
they 10 w 2936
neither 2 w 2943
help 1 w 2947
nor 2 w 2950
hinder 1 w 2956
the 51 w 2959
effort 1 w 2965
to 28 w 2967
attain 1 w 2973
Virtue 3 w 2979
EPICURUS 5 w 2988
Certainly 2 w 2997
HERMES 1 w 3004
Stoa 6 w 3008
the 52 w 3012
jurors 1 w 3018
say 2 w 3021
they 11 w 3025
can 2 w 3028
t 270 w 3030
understand 2 w 3040
these 1 w 3045
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questions 2 w 3065
so 7 w 3068
be 18 w 3070
silent 1 w 3076
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voting 1 w 3090
STOA 5 w 3095
I 12 w 3096
should 3 w 3102
have 6 w 3106
won 1 w 3109
if 8 w 3111
I 13 w 3112
had 3 w 3115
put 4 w 3118
him 6 w 3121
a 251 w 3122
question 4 w 3130
in 61 w 3132
the 56 w 3135
form 2 w 3139
of 27 w 3141
the 57 w 3144
third 1 w 3150
indemonstrable 1 w 3164
The 1 w 3169
five 1 w 3173
indemonstrables 1 w 3189
of 28 w 3192
Chrysippus 1 w 3202
so 8 w 3205
called 1 w 3211
because 3 w 3218
they 13 w 3222
are 6 w 3225
self-evident 1 w 3237
and 31 w 3240
require 1 w 3247
no 12 w 3249
proof 1 w 3254
were 2 w 3259
all 5 w 3262
hypothetical 1 w 3274
or 25 w 3276
disjunctive 1 w 3287
syllogisms 1 w 3297
examples 1 w 3306
are 7 w 3309
1 2 w 3312
if 9 w 3316
it 27 w 3318
is 20 w 3320
day 1 w 3323
it 28 w 3326
is 21 w 3328
light 1 w 3333
it 29 w 3336
is 22 w 3338
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it 30 w 3347
is 23 w 3349
day 2 w 3352
2 2 w 3356
if 10 w 3360
it 31 w 3362
is 24 w 3364
day 3 w 3367
it 32 w 3370
is 25 w 3372
light 3 w 3377
it 33 w 3380
is 26 w 3382
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it 34 w 3390
is 27 w 3392
not 4 w 3395
day 4 w 3398
3 2 w 3402
Plato 1 w 3409
is 28 w 3411
not 5 w 3414
both 1 w 3418
dead 1 w 3422
and 32 w 3425
alive 1 w 3430
he 89 w 3433
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not 6 w 3448
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4 3 w 3457
it 35 w 3461
is 31 w 3463
either 3 w 3469
day 5 w 3472
or 26 w 3474
night 1 w 3479
it 37 w 3482
is 32 w 3484
day 6 w 3487
it 38 w 3491
is 33 w 3493
not 7 w 3496
night 2 w 3501
5 1 w 3505
it 39 w 3509
is 34 w 3511
either 4 w 3517
day 7 w 3520
or 27 w 3522
night 3 w 3527
it 41 w 3530
is 35 w 3532
not 8 w 3535
night 4 w 3540
it 42 w 3544
is 36 w 3546
day 8 w 3549
Cf 1 w 3553
Diog 1 w 3558
Laert 1 w 3564
Vit 1 w 3568
Phil 1 w 3573
7 1 w 3575
1 3 w 3577
49 1 w 3580
Sext 1 w 3585
Emp 1 w 3589
adv 1 w 3593
Math 1 w 3598
7 2 w 3600
JUSTICE 1 w 3608
Who 2 w 3611
won 2 w 3614
HERMES 2 w 3621
Pleasure 8 w 3629
unanimously 1 w 3641
STOA 6 w 3646
I 15 w 3647
appeal 1 w 3653
to 31 w 3655
Zeus 1 w 3659
JUSTICE 2 w 3667
Good 1 w 3671
luck 1 w 3675
to 32 w 3677
you 6 w 3680
Hermes 1 w 3687
call 2 w 3692
another 1 w 3699
case 3 w 3703
HERMES 3 w 3710
Virtue 4 w 3716
v 36 w 3717
High-living 1 w 3729
im 15 w 3732
re 43 w 3734
Aristippus 1 w 3744
Let 2 w 3748
Aristippus 2 w 3758
appear 1 w 3764
in 65 w 3766
person 1 w 3772
VIRTUE 1 w 3779
I 18 w 3780
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to 33 w 3787
speak 1 w 3792
first 1 w 3797
I 19 w 3799
am 6 w 3801
Virtue 5 w 3807
and 33 w 3811
Aristippus 3 w 3821
belongs 1 w 3828
to 34 w 3830
me 14 w 3832
as 40 w 3835
his 8 w 3838
words 2 w 3843
and 34 w 3846
his 9 w 3849
deeds 1 w 3854
indicate 1 w 3862
HIGH-LIVING 1 w 3874
No 2 w 3876
indeed 2 w 3883
I 23 w 3885
ought 4 w 3890
to 35 w 3892
speak 2 w 3897
first 2 w 3902
I 24 w 3904
am 7 w 3906
High-living 2 w 3917
and 35 w 3921
the 63 w 3924
man 8 w 3927
is 42 w 3929
mine 2 w 3933
as 41 w 3936
you 7 w 3939
can 3 w 3942
see 6 w 3945
from 4 w 3949
his 10 w 3952
garlands 1 w 3960
his 11 w 3964
purple 1 w 3970
cloak 1 w 3975
and 37 w 3978
his 12 w 3981
perfumes 1 w 3989
JUSTICE 3 w 3997
Do 3 w 3999
not 10 w 4002
wrangle 1 w 4009
this 3 w 4014
case 4 w 4018
will 4 w 4022
stand 3 w 4027
over 5 w 4031
until 2 w 4036
Zeus 2 w 4040
decides 1 w 4047
the 64 w 4050
case 5 w 4054
of 30 w 4056
Dionysius 3 w 4065
for 10 w 4069
this 4 w 4073
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