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A Discourse Concerning Socrates's Daemon (15-16)

urn:cts:greekLit:tlg0007.tlg109.perseus-eng2:15-16
Refs {'start': {'reference': '15', 'human_reference': 'Section 15'}, 'end': {'reference': '16', 'human_reference': 'Section 16'}}
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What then, said Theanor, is it mean to think poverty a grievance? Is it not absurd to fly and be afraid of

riches, if no reason, but an hypocritical pretence, narrowness of mind, or pride, prompts one to reject the offer? And what reason, I wonder, would refuse such advantageous and creditable enjoyments as Epaminondas now doth? But, sir,—for your answer to the Thessalian about this matter slows you very ready,—pray answer me, do you think it commendable in some cases to give money, but always unlawful to receive it? Or are the givers and receivers equally guilty of a fault? By no means, replied Epaminondas; but, as of any thing else, so the giving and receiving of money is sometimes commendable and sometimes base. Well then, said Theanor, if a man gives willingly what he ought to give, is not that action commendable in him? Yes. And when it is commendable in one to give, is it not as commendable in another to receive? Or can a man more honestly accept a gift from any one, than from him that honestly bestows? No. Well then, Epaminondas, suppose of two friends, one hath a mind to present, the other must accept. It is true, in a battle we should avoid that enemy who is skilful in hurling his weapon; but in civilities we should neither fly nor thrust back that friend that makes a kind and genteel offer. And though poverty is not so grievous, yet on the other side, wealth is not so mean and despicable a thing. Very true, replied Epaminondas; but you must consider that sometimes, even when a gift is honestly bestowed, he is more commendable who refuses it. For we have many lusts and desires, and the objects of those desires are many. Some arc called natural; these proceed from the very constitution of our body, and tend to natural pleasures; others are acquired, and rise from vain opinions and mistaken notions; yet these by the length of time, ill habits, and bad education are usually improved, get strength, and debase the soul more than the other natural and necessary passions. By custom and care any one, with the assistance
of reason, may free himself from many of his natural desires. But, sir, all our arts, all our force of discipline, must be employed against the superfluous and acquired appetites; and they must be restrained or cut off by the guidance or edge of reason. For if the contrary applications of reason can make us forbear meat and drink, when hungry or thirsty, how much more easy is it to conquer covetousness or ambition, which will be destroyed by a bare restraint from their proper objects, and a non-attainment of their desired end? And pray, sir, are you not of the same opinion? Yes, replied the stranger. Then, sir, continued Epaminondas, do you not perceive a difference between the exercise itself and the work to which the exercise relates? For instance, in a wrestler, the work is the striving with his adversary for the crown, the exercise is the preparation of his body by diet, wrestling, or the like. So in virtue, you must confess the work to be one thing and the exercise another. Very well, replied the stranger. Then, continued Epaminondas, let us first examine whether to abstain from the base unlawful pleasures is the exercise of continence, or the work and evidence of that exercise? The work and evidence, replied the stranger. But is not the exercise of it such as you practise, when after wrestling, where you have raised your appetites like ravenous beasts, you stand a long while at a table covered with plenty and variety of meats, and then give it to your servants to feast on, whilst you offer mean and spare diet to your subdued appetites? For abstinence from lawful pleasure is exercise against unlawful. Very well, replied the stranger. So, continued Epaminondas, justice is exercise against covetousness and love of money; but so is not a mere cessation from stealing or robbing our neighbor. So he that doth not betray his country or friends for gold doth not exercise against covetousness, for the law perhaps deters, and fear restrains him; but he
that refuseth just gain and such as the law allows, voluntarily exercises, and secures himself from being bribed or receiving any unlawful present. For when great, hurtful, and base pleasures are proposed, it is very hard for any one to contain himself, who hath not often despised those which he had power and opportunity to enjoy. Thus, when base bribes and considerable advantages are offered, it will be difficult to refuse, unless he hath long ago rooted out all thoughts of gain and love of money; for other desires will nourish and increase that appetite, and he will easily be drawn to any unjust action who can scarce forbear reaching out his hand to a proffered present. But he that will not lay himself open to the favors of friends and the gifts of kings, but refuseth even what Fortune proffers, and keeps off his appetite, that is eager after and (as it were) leaps forward to an appearing treasure, is never disturbed or tempted to unlawful actions, but hath great and brave thoughts, and hath command over himself, being conscious of none but generous designs. 1 and Caphisias, dear Simmias, being passionate admirers of such men, beg the stranger to suffer us to be taught and exercised by poverty to attain that height of virtue and perfection.

My brother having finished this discourse, Simmias, nodding twice or thrice, said: Epaminondas is a great man, but this Polymnis is the cause of his greatness, who gave his children the best education, and bred them philosophers. But, sir, you may end this dispute at leisure among yourselves. As for Lysis (if it is lawful to discover it), pray, sir, do you design to take him out of his tomb and transport him into Italy, or leave him here amongst his friends and acquaintance, who shall be glad to lie by him in the grave? And Theanor with a smile answered: Lysis, good Simmias, no doubt is very well pleased with the place, for Epaminondas supplied him with all things necessary and fitting. But the Pythagoreans have some

particular funeral ceremonies, which if any one wants, we conclude he did not make a proper and happy exit. Therefore, as soon as we learned from some dreams that Lysis was dead (for we have certain marks to know the apparitions of the living from images of the dead), most began to think that Lysis, dying in a strange country, was not interred with the due ceremonies, and therefore ought to be removed to Italy that he might receive them there. I coming upon this design, and being by the people of the country directed to the tomb, in the evening poured out my oblations, and called upon the soul of Lysis to come out and direct me in this affair. The night drawing on, I saw nothing indeed, but thought I heard a voice saying: Move not those relics that ought not to be moved, for Lysiss body was duly and religiously interred; and his soul is sent to inform another body, and committed to the care of another Daemon. And early this morning, asking Epaminondas about the manner of Lysiss burial, I found that Lysis had taught him as far as the incommunicable mysteries of our sect; and that the same Daemon that waited on Lysis presided over him, if I can guess at the pilot from the sailing of the ship. The paths of life are large, but in few are men directed by the Daemons. When Theanor had said this, he looked attentively on Epaminondas, as if he designed a fresh search into his nature and inclinations.

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1 1 w 4226
and 46 w 4229
Caphisias 1 w 4238
dear 1 w 4243
Simmias 1 w 4250
being 3 w 4256
passionate 1 w 4266
admirers 1 w 4274
of 37 w 4276
such 4 w 4280
men 9 w 4283
beg 1 w 4287
the 58 w 4290
stranger 5 w 4298
to 33 w 4300
suffer 1 w 4306
us 30 w 4308
to 34 w 4310
be 22 w 4312
taught 1 w 4318
and 47 w 4321
exercised 1 w 4330
by 5 w 4332
poverty 3 w 4339
to 35 w 4341
attain 2 w 4347
that 13 w 4351
height 1 w 4357
of 38 w 4359
virtue 2 w 4365
and 48 w 4368
perfection 1 w 4378
My 1 w 4381
brother 1 w 4388
having 1 w 4394
finished 1 w 4402
this 2 w 4406
discourse 1 w 4415
Simmias 2 w 4423
nodding 1 w 4431
twice 1 w 4436
or 43 w 4438
thrice 1 w 4444
said 3 w 4449
Epaminondas 8 w 4461
is 56 w 4463
a 344 w 4464
great 3 w 4469
man 7 w 4472
but 11 w 4476
this 3 w 4480
Polymnis 1 w 4488
is 59 w 4490
the 60 w 4493
cause 1 w 4498
of 39 w 4500
his 12 w 4503
greatness 1 w 4512
who 5 w 4516
gave 1 w 4520
his 13 w 4523
children 1 w 4531
the 61 w 4534
best 3 w 4538
education 2 w 4547
and 49 w 4551
bred 1 w 4555
them 1 w 4559
philosophers 1 w 4571
But 5 w 4575
sir 10 w 4579
you 15 w 4583
may 2 w 4586
end 13 w 4589
this 4 w 4593
dispute 1 w 4600
at 45 w 4602
leisure 1 w 4609
among 1 w 4614
yourselves 1 w 4624
As 1 w 4627
for 11 w 4630
Lysis 1 w 4635
if 9 w 4638
it 31 w 4640
is 66 w 4642
lawful 7 w 4648
to 36 w 4650
discover 1 w 4658
it 32 w 4660
pray 3 w 4666
sir 11 w 4670
do 6 w 4673
you 17 w 4676
design 2 w 4682
to 37 w 4684
take 2 w 4688
him 9 w 4691
out 4 w 4694
of 40 w 4696
his 15 w 4699
tomb 1 w 4703
and 50 w 4706
transport 1 w 4715
him 10 w 4718
into 1 w 4722
Italy 1 w 4727
or 46 w 4730
leave 1 w 4735
him 11 w 4738
here 2 w 4742
amongst 1 w 4749
his 16 w 4752
friends 4 w 4759
and 51 w 4762
acquaintance 1 w 4774
who 6 w 4778
shall 1 w 4783
be 24 w 4785
glad 1 w 4789
to 40 w 4791
lie 7 w 4794
by 6 w 4796
him 12 w 4799
in 73 w 4801
the 63 w 4804
grave 1 w 4809
And 5 w 4813
Theanor 3 w 4820
with 4 w 4824
a 371 w 4825
smile 1 w 4830
answered 1 w 4838
Lysis 2 w 4844
good 1 w 4849
Simmias 3 w 4856
no 37 w 4859
doubt 1 w 4864
is 71 w 4866
very 4 w 4870
well 3 w 4874
pleased 1 w 4881
with 5 w 4885
the 64 w 4888
place 1 w 4893
for 12 w 4897
Epaminondas 9 w 4908
supplied 1 w 4916
him 13 w 4919
with 6 w 4923
all 9 w 4926
things 1 w 4932
necessary 2 w 4941
and 52 w 4944
fitting 1 w 4951
But 6 w 4955
the 65 w 4958
Pythagoreans 1 w 4970
have 3 w 4974
some 5 w 4978
particular 1 w 4988
funeral 1 w 4995
ceremonies 1 w 5005
which 4 w 5011
if 10 w 5013
any 10 w 5016
one 16 w 5019
wants 1 w 5024
we 16 w 5027
conclude 1 w 5035
he 94 w 5037
did 1 w 5040
not 17 w 5043
make 3 w 5047
a 390 w 5048
proper 2 w 5054
and 53 w 5057
happy 1 w 5062
exit 1 w 5066
Therefore 1 w 5076
as 45 w 5079
soon 1 w 5083
as 46 w 5085
we 17 w 5087
learned 1 w 5094
from 11 w 5098
some 6 w 5102
dreams 1 w 5108
that 14 w 5112
Lysis 3 w 5117
was 1 w 5120
dead 1 w 5124
for 14 w 5128
we 18 w 5130
have 4 w 5134
certain 1 w 5141
marks 1 w 5146
to 41 w 5148
know 1 w 5152
the 66 w 5155
apparitions 1 w 5166
of 41 w 5168
the 67 w 5171
living 1 w 5177
from 12 w 5181
images 1 w 5187
of 42 w 5189
the 68 w 5192
dead 2 w 5196
most 1 w 5202
began 1 w 5207
to 42 w 5209
think 3 w 5214
that 15 w 5218
Lysis 4 w 5223
dying 1 w 5229
in 81 w 5231
a 409 w 5232
strange 6 w 5239
country 2 w 5246
was 2 w 5250
not 18 w 5253
interred 1 w 5261
with 7 w 5265
the 69 w 5268
due 2 w 5271
ceremonies 2 w 5281
and 54 w 5285
therefore 1 w 5294
ought 4 w 5299
to 43 w 5301
be 26 w 5303
removed 1 w 5310
to 44 w 5312
Italy 2 w 5317
that 16 w 5321
he 101 w 5323
might 1 w 5328
receive 4 w 5335
them 2 w 5339
there 2 w 5344
I 6 w 5346
coming 1 w 5352
upon 1 w 5356
this 5 w 5360
design 3 w 5366
and 55 w 5370
being 4 w 5375
by 7 w 5377
the 73 w 5380
people 1 w 5386
of 43 w 5388
the 74 w 5391
country 3 w 5398
directed 1 w 5406
to 45 w 5408
the 75 w 5411
tomb 2 w 5415
in 85 w 5418
the 76 w 5421
evening 1 w 5428
poured 1 w 5434
out 5 w 5437
my 2 w 5439
oblations 1 w 5448
and 56 w 5452
called 2 w 5458
upon 2 w 5462
the 77 w 5465
soul 2 w 5469
of 44 w 5471
Lysis 5 w 5476
to 47 w 5478
come 1 w 5482
out 6 w 5485
and 57 w 5488
direct 2 w 5494
me 31 w 5496
in 87 w 5498
this 6 w 5502
affair 1 w 5508
The 9 w 5512
night 1 w 5517
drawing 1 w 5524
on 76 w 5526
I 7 w 5528
saw 1 w 5531
nothing 1 w 5538
indeed 1 w 5544
but 12 w 5548
thought 3 w 5555
I 8 w 5556
heard 1 w 5561
a 425 w 5562
voice 1 w 5567
saying 1 w 5573
Move 1 w 5578
not 20 w 5581
those 3 w 5586
relics 1 w 5592
that 17 w 5596
ought 6 w 5601
not 21 w 5604
to 48 w 5606
be 28 w 5608
moved 2 w 5613
for 16 w 5617
Lysis 6 w 5622
s 389 w 5624
body 3 w 5628
was 3 w 5631
duly 1 w 5635
and 58 w 5638
religiously 1 w 5649
interred 2 w 5657
and 59 w 5661
his 19 w 5664
soul 3 w 5668
is 79 w 5670
sent 4 w 5674
to 49 w 5676
inform 1 w 5682
another 3 w 5689
body 4 w 5693
and 60 w 5697
committed 1 w 5706
to 50 w 5708
the 79 w 5711
care 2 w 5715
of 45 w 5717
another 4 w 5724
Daemon 1 w 5730
And 6 w 5734
early 1 w 5739
this 7 w 5743
morning 1 w 5750
asking 1 w 5757
Epaminondas 10 w 5768
about 2 w 5773
the 81 w 5776
manner 1 w 5782
of 46 w 5784
Lysis 7 w 5789
s 401 w 5791
burial 1 w 5797
I 9 w 5799
found 1 w 5804
that 18 w 5808
Lysis 8 w 5813
had 2 w 5816
taught 2 w 5822
him 14 w 5825
as 52 w 5827
far 1 w 5830
as 53 w 5832
the 82 w 5835
incommunicable 1 w 5849
mysteries 1 w 5858
of 47 w 5860
our 13 w 5863
sect 1 w 5867
and 61 w 5871
that 19 w 5875
the 83 w 5878
same 2 w 5882
Daemon 2 w 5888
that 20 w 5892
waited 1 w 5898
on 80 w 5900
Lysis 9 w 5905
presided 1 w 5913
over 7 w 5917
him 15 w 5920
if 11 w 5923
I 10 w 5924
can 4 w 5927
guess 1 w 5932
at 54 w 5934
the 84 w 5937
pilot 1 w 5942
from 13 w 5946
the 85 w 5949
sailing 1 w 5956
of 48 w 5958
the 86 w 5961
ship 1 w 5965
The 10 w 5969
paths 1 w 5974
of 49 w 5976
life 1 w 5980
are 12 w 5983
large 1 w 5988
but 13 w 5992
in 99 w 5994
few 1 w 5997
are 13 w 6000
men 10 w 6003
directed 2 w 6011
by 8 w 6013
the 87 w 6016
Daemons 1 w 6023
When 1 w 6028
Theanor 4 w 6035
had 3 w 6038
said 4 w 6042
this 8 w 6046
he 124 w 6049
looked 1 w 6055
attentively 1 w 6066
on 82 w 6068
Epaminondas 11 w 6079
as 55 w 6082
if 13 w 6084
he 125 w 6086
designed 1 w 6094
a 471 w 6095
fresh 1 w 6100
search 1 w 6106
into 2 w 6110
his 22 w 6113
nature 1 w 6119
and 62 w 6122
inclinations 1 w 6134