THE SECOND INCONVENIENCE EXAMINED.

THE second Inconuenience like to grow, (as the Lord Cardinall seemeth to be halfe afraid) Pag. 86. if the Article of the third Estate might haue passed with approba- tion, is couched in these words: Lay-men shall by authoritie bee strengthened with power, to iudge in matters of Religion; as also to determine the doctrine comprised in the said Article to haue requisite conformitie with Gods word: yea they shall haue it in their hands to compell Ecclesiastics by necessitie, to sweare, preach, and teach the opinion of the one side, as also by Sermons and publike writings to impugne the other. This inconuenience he aggrauateth with swelling words, and breaketh out into these vehement exclamations: O reproach, O scandall, O gate set open to a world of heresies. He therefore laboureth both by reasons, and by authorities of holy Scripture, to make such vsurped power of Laics, a fowle, shameful, and odious practise. In the whole, his Lordship toyles himselfe in vaine, & maketh suppositions of castles in the aire. For in preferring this Article, the third Estate haue born themselues not as iudges or vmpires, but altogether as petitioners: re- questing the said Article might be received into the number of the Parliament bookes to bee presented vnto the King and his Counsell, vnto whom in all humili- tie they referred the iudgment of the said Article; conceiuing all good hope the Clergie and Nobilitie would be pleased to ioyne for the furtherance of their humble petition. They were not so ignorant of State-matters, or so vnmindfull of their owne places and charges, to beare themselues in hand, that a petition put vp and preferred by the third Estate, can carry the force of a Law or Statute, so long as the other two Orders withstand the same, and so long as the King himselfe holds backe his Royall consent. Besides, the said Article was not propounded as a point of Religious doctrine; but for euer after to remaine and continue a funda- mentall Law of the Common-wealth and State it selfe, the due care whereof was put into their handes, and committed to their trust. If the King had ratified the said Article with Royall consent, and had commanded the Clergie to put in execu- tion the contents thereof; it had bene their duetie to see the Kings will and pleasure fulfilled, as they are subiects bound to giue him aide in all things, which may any way serue to procure the safetie of his life, and the tranquilitie of his Kingdome: Which if the Clergie had performed to the vttermost of their power, they had not shewed obedience as vnderlings, vnto the third Estate, but vnto the King alone; by whom such command had bene imposed, vpon suggestion of his faithfull subiects, made the more watchfull by the negligence of the Clergie; whom they perceiue to be lincked with stricter bandes vnto the Pope, then they are vnto their King. Here then the Cardinall fights with meere shadowes, and mooues a doubt whereof his aduersaries haue not so much as once thought in a dreame: But yet, according to his great dexteritie and nimblenesse of spirit, by this deuice he cunningly takes vpon him to giue the King a lesson with more libertie; making semblance to direct his masked Oration to the Deputies of the people, when hee shooteth in effect, and pricketh at his King, the Princes also and Lords of his Counsell, whom the Cardinall compriseth vnder the name of Laics; whose iudgment (it is not vnlikely) was apprehended much better by the Clergie, then the iudgement of the third Estate. Now these are the men whom he tearmes intruders into other mens charges, and such as open a gate for I wot not how many legions of heresies, to rush into the Church: For if it be proper to the Clergie and their Head, to iudge in this cause of the Right of Kings; then the King himselfe, his Princes, and Nobilitie, are debarred and wiped of all iudgement in the same cause, no lesse then the representatiue body of the people.

Well then, the L. CardinallPag. 61. showres downe like haile sundry places and testimonies of Scripture, where the people are commanded to haue their Pastors in singular loue, and to beare them all respects of due obseruance. Be it so; yet are the said passages of Scripture no barre to the people, for their vigilant circum- spection, to preserue the life and Crowne of their Prince, against all the wicked enterprises of men stirred vp by the Clergie, who haue their Head out of the King- dome, and hold themselues to be none of the Kings subiects: a thing neuer spoken by the sacrificing Priests and Prelates, mentioned in the passages alleadged by the Lord Cardinal. He likewise produceth two Christian Emperours,Pag. 68. Constantine and Valentinian by name; the first refusing to meddle with iudgement in Episcopall causes: the other forbearing to iudge of subtile Questions in Diuinity, with protestation, that Hee would neuer bee so curious, to diue into the streames, or sound the bottome of so deepe matters. But who doth not know, that working and prouid- ing for the Kings indemnitie and safetie, is neither Episcopall cause, nor matter of curious and subtile inquisition ? The same answere meets with all the rest of the places produced by the L. Cardinal out of the Fathers. And that one for example, out of Gregory Nazianzenus,Orat. ad ciues timore perculsos. is not cited by the Cardinall with faire dealing. For Gregory doeth not boord the Emperour himselfe, but his Deputy or L. President, on this maner: For we also are in authoritie and place of a Ruler, we haue command aswell as your selfe:a)/rxomen ga\r kai\ au)toi\ wheras the L. Cardinal with foule play, turnes the place in these termes, We also are Emperours. Which words can beare no such inter- pretation, as well because he to whom the Bishop then spake, was not of Imperiall dignitie; as also because if the Bishop himselfe, a Bishop of so small a citie as Nazianzum, had qualified himselfe Emperour, hee should haue passed all the bounds of modestie, and had shewed himselfe arrogant aboue measure. For as touching subiection due to Christian Emperours, hee freely acknowledgeth a little before, that himselfe and his people are subiect vnto the superiour powers,u(potelei=s fo/rou. yea bound to pay them tribute. The historie of the same Gregories life doeth testifie, that he was drawen by the Arrians before the Consuls iudgement seate, and from thence returned acquitted, without either stripes or any other kinde of con- tumelious entreatie and vse: yet now at last vp starts a Prelate, who dares make this good Father vaunt himselfe to be an Emperour. It is willingly granted, that Emperours neuer challenged, neuer arrogated, to bee Soueraigne Iudges in con- trouersies of doctrine and faith; neuerthelesse it is clearer then the Sunnes light at high noone, that for moderation at Synods, for determinations and orders established in Councils, and for the discipline of the Church, they haue made a good and a full vse of their Imperiall authoritie. The first CouncilVide Canones Graecos a Tilio editos. held at Con- stantinople, beares this title or inscription; The dedication of the holy Synode to the most religious Emperour Theodosius the Great, to whose will and pleasure they haue submitted these Canons by them addressed and established in Councill. And there they also beseech the Emperour, to confirme and approue the said Canons. The like hath bene done by the Council of Trullo, by whom the Canons of the fift and sixt Councils were put foorth and published. This was not done, because Em- perours tooke vpon them to bee infallible Iudges of doctrine; but onely that Emperours might see and iudge, whether Bishops (who feele the pricke of am- bition as other men doe) did propound nothing in their Conuocations and Con- sultations, but most of all in their Determinations, to vndermine the Emperours authoritie, to disturbe the tranquilitie of the Common-wealth, and to crosse the determinations of precedent Councils. Now to take the cognizance of such matters out of the Kings hand or power; what is it but euen to transforme the King into a standing Image, to wring and wrest him out of all care of himselfe and his Kingly Charge, yea to bring him downe to this basest condition, to be- come onely an executioner, and (which I scorne to speake) the vnhappy hangman of the Clergies will, without any further cognizance, not so much as of matters which most neerely touch himselfe, and his Royall estate ?

I grant it is for Diuinitie Scholes, to iudge how farre the power of the Keyes doth stretch: I grant againe, that Clerics both may, and ought also to display the colours and ensignes of their censures against Princes, who violating their publike and solemne oath, doe raise and make open warre against Iesus Christ: I grant yet againe, that in this case they need not admit Laics to be of their coun- sell, nor allow them any scope or libertie of iudgement. Yet all this makes no barre to Clerics, for extending the power of their keyes, many times a whole degree further then they ought; and when they are pleased, to make vse of their said power, to depriue the people of their goods, or the Prince of his Crowne: all this doeth not hinder Prince or people from taking care for the preseruation of their owne rights and estates, nor from requiring Clerics to shew their cards, and produce their Charts, and to make demonstration by Scripture, that such power as they assume and challenge, is giuen them from God. For to leaue the Pope absolute Iudge in the same cause, wherein hee is a partie, and (which is the strongest rampier and bulwarke, yea the most glorious and eminent point of his domination) to arme him with power to vnhorse Kings out of their seates; what is it else but euen to draw them into a state of despaire for euer winning the day, or preuailing in their honourable and rightful cause ?

It is moreouer granted, if a King shall command any thing directly contrary to Gods word, and tending to the subuerting of the Church; that Clerics in this case ought not onely to dispense with subiects for their obedience, but also ex- presly to forbid their obedience: For it is alwayes better to obey God then man. Howbeit in all other matters, whereby the glory and maiestie of God is not impeached or impaired, it is the duety of Clerics to plie the people with wholesome exhortation to constant obedience, and to auert by earnest disswasions the said people from tumultuous reuolt and seditious insurrection. This practise vnder the Pagan Emperours, was held and followed by the ancient Christians; by whose godly zeale and patience in bearing the yoke, the Church in times past grew and flourished in her happy and plentifull increase, farre greater then Poperie shall euer purchase and attaine vnto by all her cunning deuices and sleights: as namely by degrading of Kings, by interdicting of Kingdoms, by apposted murders, and by Diabolicall traines of Gunne-powder-mines.

The places of Scripture alleadged in order by the Cardinal, in fauour of those that stand for the Popes claime of power and authoritie to depose Kings, are cited with no more sincerity then the former: They alledge (these are his words) that Samuel deposed King Saul, or declared him to bee deposed, because hee had violated the Lawes of the Iewes Religion: Pag 66. His Lordship auoucheth elsewere, that Saul was deposed, because he had sought prophanely to vsurpe the holy Priest- hood. Both false and contrary to the tenour of trewth in the sacred history: For Saul was neuer deposed according to the sense of the word (I meane, depose) in the present question; to wit, as deposing is taken for despoiling the King of his royall dignitie, and reducing the King to the condition of a priuate person: But Saul 1. Sam. 23. 20. & 24. 15. & 2. Sam. 2. 5. held the title of King, and continued in possession of his Kingdome, euen to his dying day. Yea, the Scripture styles him King, euen to the periodicall and last day of his life, by the testimony of Dauid himselfe, who both by Gods promise, and by precedent vnction, was then heire apparant as it were to the Crown, in a maner then ready to gird and adorne the temples of his head. For if Samuel, by Gods commandement, had then actually remooued Saul from his Throne, doubt- lesse the whole Church of Israel had committed a grosse errour, in taking and honouring Saul for their King, after such deposition: doubtlesse the Prophet Samuel himselfe, making knowen the Lords Ordinance vnto the people, would haue enioyned them by strict prohibition to call him no longer the King of Israel: Doubtlesse, Dauid would neuer haue held his hand from the throat of Saul, for this respect and consideration, because he was the Lords Anointed.1. Sam. 26. 11. For if Saul had lost his Kingly authority, from that instant when Samuel gaue him knowl- edge of his reiection; then Dauid, lest otherwise the Body of the Kingdome should want a Royall Head, was to beginne his Reigne, and to beare the Royall scepter in the very same instant: which were to charge the holy Scriptures with vntrewth, in as much as the sacred historie begins the computation of the yeeres of Dauids Reigne, from the day of Sauls death. Trew it is, that in the I. Sam. cap. 15. Saul was denounced by Gods owne sentence, a man reiected, and as it were excommunicated out of the Kingdome, that hee should not rule and reigne any longer as King ouer Israel; neuerthelesse, the said sentence was not put in execution, before the day when God, executing vpon Saul an exemplarie iudge- ment, did strike him with death. From whence it is manifest and cleare, that when Dauid was annointed King by Samuel, that action was onely a promise,1. Sam. 16. 23. and a testimony of the choice, which God had made of Dauid for succession immediately after Saul; and not a present establishment, inuestment, or install- ment of Dauid in the Kingdome. Wee reade the like in I. King. cap. 19. where God commandeth Elias the Prophet, to annoint Hasael King of Syria: For can any man bee so blinde and ignorant in the sacred historie, to beleeue the Prophets of Israel established, or sacred the Kings of Syria ? For this cause, when Dauid was actually established in the Kingdome, hee was annointed the second time.2. Sam. 2. 4.

In the next place he brings in the Popes champions vsing these words; 1. King. 12. Rehoboam was deposed by Ahiah the Prophet, from his Royall right ouer the tenne Tribes of Israel, because his father Salomon had played the Apostata, in falling from the Law of God. This I say also is more, then the trewth of the sacred history doeth afoard: For Ahiah neuer spake to Rehoboam (for ought we reade,) nor brought vnto him any message from the Lord; As for the passagequoted by the L. Cardinal out of 3. Reg. chap. 11 . it hath not reference to the time of Rehoboams raigne, but rather indeed to Salomons time: nor doeth it carry the face of a iudicatorie sentence for the Kings deposing, but rather of a Propheticall predic- tion: For how could Rehoboam, before hee was made King, be depriued of the Kingdome ? Last of all, but worst of all; to alleadge this passage for an example of a iust sentence in matter of deposing a King, is to approoue the disloyall treacherie of a seruant against his master, and the rebellion of Ieroboam branded in Scripture with a marke of perpetuall infamie for his wickednesse and impietie.

He goes on with an other example of no more trewth;1. King. 19. King Achab was deposed by Elias the Prophet, because he imbraced false religion, and worshipped false gods. False too like the former; King Achab lost his crowne and his life both together. The Scripture, that speaketh not according to mans fancie, but according to the trewth, doeth extend and number the yeeres of Achabs raigne, to the time of his death. Predictions of a Kings ruine, are no sentences of deposition. Elias neuer gaue the subiects of Achab absolution from their oath of obedience; neuer gaue them the least inckling of any such absolution; neuer set vp, or placed any other King in Achabs throne.

That of the L. Cardinall Pag. 68. a little after, is no lesse vntrew: That King Vzziah was driuenfrom the conuersation of the people by Azarias the Priest, and thereby the administration of his Kingdome was left no longer in his power. Not so: For when God had smitten Vzziah with leprosie in his forehead, he withdrew himselfe,2. Chro. 26. or went out into an house apart, for feare of infecting such as were whole by his con- tagious disease. The high Priest smote him not with any sentence of deposition, or denounced him suspended from the administration of his Kingdome. No: the dayes of his raigne are numbred in Scripture, to the day of his death. And whereas the Priest, according to the Law in the 13. of Leuit. iudged the King to be vncleane; he gaue sentence against him, not as against a criminal person, and thereby within the compasse of deposition; but as against a diseased body: For the Law inflicteth punishments, not vpon diseases, but vpon crimes. Hereupon, whereas it is recorded by Iosephus Antiq. 1. 9. cap. 11. in his Antiquities, that Vzziah led a priuate, and in a maner, a solitarie life; the said author doeth not meane, that Vzziah was deposed, but onely that he disburdened himselfe of care to mannage the publique affaires.

The example of Mattathias,Pag. 69. by whom the Iewes were stirred vp to rebel against Antiochus, is no better worth: For in that example we finde no sentence of deposition, but onely an heartning and commotion of a people then grieuously afflicted and oppressed. He that makes himselfe the ringleader of conspiracie against a King, doeth not foorthwith assume the person, or take vp the office and charge of a Iudge, in forme of Law, and iuridically to depriue a King of his Regall rights, and Royall prerogatiues. Mattathias was chiefe of that conspiracie, not in qualitie of Priest, but of cheiftaine, or leader in warre and a man the best qualified of all the people. Things acted by the suddaine violence of the base vulgar, muste not stand for Lawes, nor yet for proofes and arguments of ordinarie power, such as the Pope challengeth to himselfe, and appropriateth to his triple-Crowne.

These be our solide answeres: we disclaime the light armour which the L. CardinallPage 67. is pleased to furnish vs withall, forsooth to recreate himselfe, in rebat- ing the points of such weapons, as hee hath vouchsafed to put into our hands. Now it wil be worth our labour to beate by his thrusts, fetch from the ordinary mission of the New Testament, from leprosie, stones, and locks of wooll: A leach no doubt of admirable skill, one that for subiecting the Crownes of Kings vnto the Pope, is able to extract arguments out of stones; yea, out of the leprosie, and the drie scab, onely forsooth because heresie is a kind of leprosie, and an heretike hath some affinitie with a leper. But may not his Quoniam, bee as fitly applyed to any contagious and inueterate vice of the minde beside heresie ? His warning- piece Page 66. therefore is discharged to purpose, whereby hee notifies that hee pretendeth to handle nothing with resolution: For indeed vpon so weake arguments, a resolution is but ill-fauouredly and weakely grounded.

His bulwarkes thus beaten downe, let vs now view the strength of our owne. First, he makes vs to fortifie on this maner: They that are for the negatiue, doe alleadge the authoritie of S. Paul; Let euery soule bee subiect vnto the higher powers: For whosoeuer resisteth the power, resisteth the ordinance of God. And likewise that of S. Peter; Submit your selues, whether it be vnto the King, as vnto the superiour, or vnto gouernours, &c. Vpon these passages, and the like, they in ferre, that the obedience is due to Kings by the Law of God, and not dispensable by any Spirituall or Temporall authoritie.Page 69. Thus he brings vs in with our first weapon. But here the very chiefe sinew and strength of our argument, hee doeth wittingly balked and of purpose conceale: To wit; That all the Emperors of whom the said holy Apostles haue made any mention in their diuine Epistles, were professed enemies to CHRIST, Pagans, Infidels, fearefull and bloody Tyrants: to whom notwithstand- ing euery soule, and therefore the Bishop of Rome for one, is commanded to sub- mit himselfe, and to professe subiection. Thus much Chrysostome hath expresly taught in his Hom. 23. vpon the Epistle to the Romanes; The Apostle giues this commandement vnto all: euen to Priests also, and cloistered Monkes not onely to Secular: be thou an Apostle, an Euangelist, a Prophet, &.c. Besides, it is here worthy to be noted, that howsoeuer the Apostles rule is generall, and therefore bindeth all the faithfull in equall bands; yet is it particularly, directly, and of purpose addressed to the Church of Rome by S. Paul, as by one who in the spirit of an Apostle did foresee, that rebellion against Princes was to rise and spring from the citie of Rome. Now in case the Head of that Church by warrant of any priuiledge, contained in the most holy Register of Gods holy word, is exempted from the binding power of this generall precept or rule; did it not become his Lord- ship to shew by the booke, that it is a booke case, and to lay it foorth before that honourable assembly, who no doubt expected and waited to heare when it might fall from his learned lips ? But in stead of any such authenticall and canonicall confirmation, he flieth to a sleight shift, and with a cauill is bold to affirme the foundation, laid by those of our side, doeth no way touch the knot of the con- trouersie. Let vs heare him speake: It is not in controuersie, whether obedience be due to kings by Gods Law, so long as they are kings, or acknowledged for Kings, but our point controuerted, is whether by Gods Law it be required, that hee who hath bene once recognised and receiuedfor King by the body of Estates, can at any time be taken and reputed as no King, that is to say can doe no maner of acte whereby hee may loose his right, and so cease to be saluted King. This answere of the L. Cardinall is the rare deuise, euasion, and starting hole of the Iesuites: In whose eares of delicate and tender touch, King-killing soundeth very harsh; but forsooth to vn-king a King first, and then to giue him the stab, that is a point of iust and trew descant: For to kill a King, once vnking'd by deposition, is not killing of a King: For the present, I haue one of that Iesuiticall Order in prison, who hath face enough to speake this language of Ashdod, and to maintaine this doctrine of the Iesuites Colledges. The L. Cardinall harpes vpon the same string; He can like subiection and obedience to the King, whilest he sitteth King: but his Holinesse must haue all power, and giue order withall, to hoyst him out of his Royall Seat. I therefore now answer, that in very deed the former passages of S. Paul and S. Peter should come nothing neere the question, if the state of the question were such as he brings it, made and forged in his owne shop. But certes the states of the ques- tion is not, whether a King may doe some acte, by reason whereof hee may fall from his right, or may not any longer be acknowledged for King: For all our contention is, concerning the Popes power to vn-authorize Princes; whereas in the question framed and fitted by the L. Cardinal, not a word of the Pope. For were it granted and agreed on both sides, that a King by election might fal from his Kingdom, yet stil the knot of the question would hold, whether he can be dis- possessed of his Regal authoritie, by any power in the Pope, & whether the Pope hath such fulnes of power, to strip a King of those Royall robes, rights, and reuenewes of the Crowne, which were neuer giuen him by the Pope; as also by what authoritie of holy Scripture, the Pope is able to beare out himselfe in this power, and to make it good.

But here the L. Card.Page 71. stoutly saith in his owne defence by way of reioinder; As one text hath, Let euery soule be subiect vnto the higher powers; in like manner an other text hath, Obey your Prelates, and be subiect vnto your Pastors: for they watch ouer your soules, as men that shall giue an accompt for your soules. This reason is void of reason, and makes against himselfe: For may not Prelates be obeyed and honoured, without Kings be deposed ? If Prelates preach the doc- trine of the Gospell, will they in the pulpit stirre vp subiects to rebell against Kings ? Moreouer, whereas the vniuersall Church in these daies is diuided into so many discrepant parts, that now Prelates neither doe nor can draw all one way; is it not exceeding hard, keeping our obedience towards God, to honour them all at once with due obedience ? Nay; is not here offered vnto me a dart out of the L. Cardinals armorie, to cast at himselfe ? For as God chargeth all men with obedience to Kings, and yet from that commaundement of God, the L. Cardinall would not haue it inferred, that Kings haue power to degrade Ecclesiasticall Prelates: euen so God giueth charge to obey Prelates, yet doeth it not follow from hence, that Prelates haue power to depose Kings. These two degrees of obedience agree well together, and are each of them bounded with peculiar and proper limits.

But for so much as in this point, we haue on our side the whole auncient Church, which, albeit she liued and groned for many aages together vnder heathen Emperours, heretikes, and persecuters, did neuer so much as whisper a word about rebelling and falling from their Soueraigne Lords, and was neuer by any mortall creature freed from the oath of allegiance to the Emperour; the Cardinall is not vnwilling to graunt, that ancient Christians in those times were bound to performe such fidelity and allegiance, for as much as the Church (the Cardinall for shame durst not say the Pope) then had not absolued them of their oath. No doubt a pleasant dreame, or a merry conceit rather, to imagine the Bishop of Rome was armed with power to take away the Empire of the world from Nero, or Claudius, or Domitianus; to whom it was not knowen, whether the citie of Rome had any Bishop at all. Is it not a master-iest, of a straine most ridiculous, to pre- suppose the Grand-masters and absolute Lords of the whole world, had a sent so dull, that the were not able to smell out, and to nose things vnder their owne noses ? that they saw so little with other mens eies and their owne, that within their capitall citie, they could not spie that Soueraigne armed with ordinary and lawfull authority to degrade, and to turne them out of their renowned Empire ? Doubtlesse the said Emperours, vassals belike of the Popes Empire, are to be held excused for not acknowledging and honouring the Pope in quality of their Lord, as became his vassals; because they did not know there was any such power in the world, as aftertimes haue magnified and adored vnder the qualitie of Pope: For the Bishops of Rome in those times, were of no greater authoritie, power, and means, then some of the Bishops are in these daies within my Kingdomes.

But certes those Popes of that primitiue aage, thought it not expedient in the said times to draw their swords: they exercised their power in a more mild and soft kind of carriage toward those miserable Emperours, for three seuerall reasons alledged by the L. Cardinall.

The first: because the Bishops then durst not by their censures whet and prouoke those Emperours, for feare of plunging the Church in a Sea of persecu- tions. But if I be not cleane voide of common sense, this reason serueth to charge not onely the Bishops of Rome, but all the auncient professors of Christ besides, with deepe dissimulation and hypocrisie: For it is all one as if he had professed, that all their obedience to their Soueraignes, was but counterfeit, and extorted, or wrong out of them by force; that all the submissiue supplications of the auncient Fathers, the assured testimonies and pledges of their allegiance, humili- tie, and patience, were but certaine formes of disguised speech, proceeding not freely from the suggestions of fidelity, but faintly and fainedly, or at least from the strong twitches and violent conuulsions of feare. Whereupon it followes, that all their torments and punishments, euen to the death, are wrongfully hon- oured with the title, and crowned with the crowne of Martyrdome; because their patience proceeded not from their owne free choice and election, but was taught by the force of necessitie, as by compulsion: and whereas they had not mu- tinously and rebelliously risen in armes, to asswage the scorching heat and burn- ing flames of tyrannicall persecuters, it was not for want of will, but for lacke of power. Which false and forged imputation, the Fathers haue cleared themselues of in their writings. TertullianTert. Apol. cap. 37. Hesterni sumus & omnia vestra impleuimus. in his Apologet: All places are full of Christians, the cities, isles, castles, burroughs, armies, &c. If we that are so infinite a power, and multitude of men, had broken from you into some remote nooke or corner of the world, the cities no doubt had become naked and solitarie: there had beene a dreadfull and horrible silence ouer the face of the whole Empire: the great Emperours had beene driuen to seeke out new cities, and to discouer newe nations, ouer whom to beare Soueragine sway and rule; there had remained more enemies to the State, then subiects and friends. CyprianCypr. cont. Demetr. also against Demetrianus: None of vs all howsoeuer we are a people mighty and without number, haue made resistance against any of your vniust and wrongfull actions, executed with all violence; neither haue sought by rebel- lious armes, or by any other sinister practices, to crie quittance with you at any time for the righting of our selues. Certaine it is, that vnder Iulianus, the whole Em- pire in a manner professed the Christian Religion; yea, that his Leiftenants and great Commanders, as Iouinianus, and Valentinianus by name, professed Christ: Which two Princes not long after attained to the Imperiall dignitie, but might haue solicited the Pope sooner to degrade Iulianus from the Imperiall Throne. For say that Iulians whole army had renounced the Christian Religion: (as the L. Cardinall against all shew and appearance of trewth would beare vs in hand, and contrary to the generall voice of the said whole army, making this profession with one consent when Iulian was dead, Wee are all Christians:) yet Italie then persisting in the faith of Christ, and the army of Iulian then lying quartered in Persia, the vtmost limit of the Empire to the East,Socr. lib. 3. cap. 19. Theod, lib. 4. cap. 1. Sozom. lib. 6. cap. 1. the Bishop of Rome had fit opportunitie to draw the sword of his authoritie (if hee had then any such sword hanging at his Pontificall side) to make Iulian feele the sharpe edge of his weapon, and thereby to pull him downe from the stately pearch of the Romane Empire. I say moreouer, that by this generall and sudden profession of the whole Caesarian armie, Wee are all Christians, it is clearly testified, that if his armie or souldiers were then addicted to Paganisme, it was wrought by compulsion, and cleane con- trary to their setled perswasion before: and then it followes, that with greater patience they would haue borne the deposing of Iulian, then if hee had suffered them to vse the libertie of their conscience. To bee short in the matter; S. Augus- tine August. in Psal. 124. makes all whole, and by his testimony doeth euince, that Iulians armie per- seuered in the faith of Christ. The souldiers of Christ serued a Heathen Emperour: But when the cause of Christ was called in question, they acknowledged none but Christ in heauen: When the Emperour would haue them to serue, and to perfume his idols with frankincense, they gaue obedience to God, rather then to the Emperour. After which words, the very same words alleadged by the L. Cardinall Page 82. against himselfe doe follow; They did then distinguish betweene the Lord Eternal, and the Lord temporall: neuerthelesse, they were subiect vnto the Lord temporall, for the Lord Eternall. It was therefore to pay God his duetie of obedience, and not for feare to incense the Emperour, or to draw persecution vpon the Church (as the L. Cardinal would made vs beleeue) that Christians of the Primitiue Church, and Bishops by their censures, durst not anger and prouoke their Emperours. But his Lordship by his coloured pretences doeth manifestly prouoke and stirre vp the people to rebellion, so soone as they know their own strength to beare out a re- bellious practise: Whereupon it followes, that in case their conspiracie shall take no good effect, all the blame and fault must lie, not in their disloyalty and treason, but in the bad choice of their times for the best aduantage, and in the want of taking a trew sight of their owne weakenesse. Let stirring spirits be trained vp in such practicall precepts, let desperate wits be seasoned with such rules of dis- cipline; and what need we, or how can wee wonder they contriue Powder-con- spiracies, and practise the damnable art of parricides ?

After Iulian, his Lordship falles vpon Valentinian the younger, who maintain- ing Arrianisme with great and open violence, might haue bene deposed by the Christians from his Empire, and yet (say wee) they neuer dream'd of any such practise. Heere the L. CardinallPag. 82. maketh answere: The Christians mooued with respect vnto the fresh memory both of the brother and father, as also vnto the weake estate of the sonnes young yeeres, abstained from all counsels and courses of sharper effect and operation. To which answere I replie: these are but friuolous coniec- tures, deuised and framed to ticle his owne fancie: For had Valentinianus the younger beene the sonne of an Arrian, and had then also attained to threescore yeeres of aage, they would neuer haue borne themselues in other fashion then they did, towards their Emperour. Then the Cardinall goeth on: The people would not abandon the factious and seditious party, but were so firme or obstinate rather for the faction, that Valentinian for feare of the tumultuous vproares was constrained to giue way, and was threatened by the souldiers, that except hee would adhere vnto the Catholikes, they would yeeld him no assistance, nor stand for his partie. Now this answere of the L. Cardinall makes nothing to the purpose, concerning the Popes power to pull downe Kings from their stately nest. Let vs take notice of his proper consequence. Valentinian was afraid of the popu- lar tumult at Milan; the Pope therefore hath power to curbe Hereticall Kings by deposition. Now marke what distance is betweene Rome and Milan, what dif- ference betweene the people of Milan, and the Bishop of Rome; betweene a popular tumult, and a iudicatorie sentence; betweene fact and right, things done by the people or souldiers of Milan, and things to be done according to right and law by the Bishop of Rome; the same distance, the same difference (if not farre greater) is betweene the L. Cardinals antecedent and his consequent, betweene his reason, and the maine cause or argument which we haue in hand. The mad commotion of the people was not heere so much to bee regarded, as the sad in- struction of the Pastour, of their good and godly Pastour S. Ambrose, so farre from hartening the people of Milan to rebel, that being Bishop of Milan, he offered himself to suffer Martydome: If the Emperour abuse his Imperiall authority, (for so Theodoret hath recited his words) to tyrannize thereby, heere am I ready to suffer death. And what resistance he made against his L. Emperor, was onely by way of supplication in these termes; Wee beseech thee, 0 Augustus, as humble suppliants; we offer no resistance: we are not infeare, but weflie to supplication. Againe, If my patrimony be your marke, enter vpon my patrimony if my body I wil goe and meet my torments. Shall I be drag'd to prison or to death ? I will take delight in both. Item, in his Oration to Auxentius; I can afflict my soule with sorrow, I can lament, I can send forth grieuous groans: My weapons against either of both, souldiers or Goths, are teares: A Priest hath none other weapons of defence: I neither can resist, nor ought in any other maner to make resistance.Epist. lib. 5. Epist. 33. Epist. lib. 5.

Iustinian the Emperour in his old aage fell into the heresie of the Aphtharto- docites. Against Iustinian, though few they were that fauoured him in that heresie, the Bishop of Rome neuer darted with violence any sentence of excom- munication, interdiction, or deposition.

The Ostrogot Kings in Italie, the Visigot in Spaine, the Vandal in Africa were all addicted to the Arrian impietie, and some of them cruelly persecuted the trew professours. The Visigot and Vandall were no neighbours to Italie. The Pope thereby had the lesse cause to feare the stings of those waspes, if they had bene angred. The Pope for all that neuer had the humour to wrestle or iustle with any of the said Kings in the cause of deposing them from their Thrones. But espe- cially the times when the Vandals in Affricke, and the Goths in Italie by Belisarius and Narses, professours of the Orthodoxe Faith, were tyred with long warres, and at last were vtterly defeated in bloody battels, are to bee considered. Then were the times or neuer, for the Pope to vnsheath his weapons, and to vncase his ar- rowes of deposition; then were the times to draw them out of his quiuer, and to shoot at all such Arrian heads; then were the times by dispensations to release their subiects of their oathes, by that peremptorie meanes to aide and strengthen the Catholique cause: But in that aage the said weapons were not knowne to haue bene hammered in the Pontificall forge. Gregorie the I. made his boasts, that he was able to ruine the Lombards, (for many yeeres together sworne enemies to the Bishops of Rome) their state present, and the hope of all their future prosperitie. But he telleth vs, that by the feare of God before his eyes and in his heart, he was bridled and restrained from any such intent; as elsewhere we haue obserued:In Apol. pro iuram. fidel. His owne words lib. 7. Epist. 1. If I would haue medled with practis- ing and procuring the death of the Lombards, the whole nation of the Lombards at this day had bene robbed of their Kings, Dukes, Earles, they had bene reduced to the tearmes of extreame confusion. He might at least haue deposed their King, (if the credit of the L. Cardinals iudgement be currant) without polluting or stayning his owne conscience.

What can we tearme this assertion of the L. Cardinal, but open charging the most ancient Bishops of Rome with crueltie, when they would not succour the Church of CHRIST oppressed by tyrants, whose oppression they had power to represse by deposing the oppressors. Is it credible, that IESVS CHRIST hath giuen a Commission to S. Peter and his successors for so many aages, without any power to execute their Commission, or to make any vse thereof by practise ? Is it credible, that hee hath giuen them a sword to bee kept in the scabbard, without drawing once in a thousand yeeres ? Is it credible, that in the times when Popes were most deboshed, abandoning themselues to all sorts of corrupt and vitious courses, as is testified by their owne flatterers and best affected seruants; it is credible that in those times they began to vnderstand the vertue & strength of their Commission ? For if either feare or lacke of power, was the cause of holding their hands, and voluntarie binding of themselues to the Peace or good behauiour: wherefore is not some one Pope at least produced, who hath complained that he was hindered from executing the power that CHRIST had conferred vpon his Pontificall See ? Wherefore is not some one of the ancient and holy Fathers alledged, by whom the Pope hath bene aduised and exhorted to take courage, to stand vpon the vigor and sinewes of his Papall Office, to vnsheath and vncase his bolts of thunder against vngodly Princes, and grieuous enemies to the Church ? wherefore liuing vnder Christian and gracious Emperours, haue they not made knowne the reasons, why they were hindred from drawing the pretended sword; lest long custome of not vsing the sword so many aages, might make it so to rust in the scabbard, that when there should be occasion to vse the said sword, it could not be drawne at all; and lest so long custome of not vsing the same, should confirme prescription to their greater preiudice ? If weakenesse be a iust let, how is it come to passe, that Popes haue enterprised to depose Philip the Faire, Lewis the XII, and ELIZABETH my predecessor of happy memorie; (to let passe others) in whom experience hath well proued, how great inequalitie was betweene their strengths ? Yea, for the most part from thence grow most grieuous troubles and warres, which iustly recoile and light vpon his owne head; as happened to Gregorie the VII. and Boniface the VIII. This no doubt is the reason, wherefore the Pope neuer sets in (for feare of such inconueniences) to blast a King with lightning and thunder of deposition, but when hee perceiues the troubled waters of the Kingdome by some strong faction setled in his Estate; or when the King is confined and bordered by some Prince more potent, who thirsteth after the prey, and is euer gaping for some occasion to picke a quarrell. The King standing in such estate, is it not as easie for the Pope to pull him downe, as it is for a man with one hand to thrust downe a tottering wall, when the groundsill is rotten, the studdes vnpind and nodding or bending towards the ground ? But if the King shall beare downe and breake the faction within the Realme; if hee shall get withall the vpper hand of his enemies out of the Kingdome; then the holy Father presents him with pardons neuer sued for, neuer asked; and in a fathers indul- gence forsooth, giues him leaue still to hold the Kingdome, that hee was not able by all his force to wrest and wring out of his hand, no more then the club of Her- cules out of his fist. How many worthy Princes, incensed by the Pope, to conspire against Soueraigne Lords their Masters, and by open rebellion to worke some change in their Estates, haue miscarried in the action, with losse of life, or honour, or both ? For example; Rodulphus Duke of Sueuia was eg'd on by the Pope, against Henry IIII. of that name Emperour. How many massacres, how many desolations of Cities and townes, how many bloody battels ensued thereupon ? Let histories bee searched, let iust accompts be taken, and besides sieges layde to Cities, it will appeare by trew computation, that Henry the IIII. and Frederic the first, fought aboue threescore battels, in defence of their owne right against enemies of the Empire, stirred vp to armes by the Pope of Rome. How much Christian blood was then spilt in these bloody battels, it passeth mans wit, penne, or tongue to expresse. And to giue a little touch vnto matters at home; doeth not his Holinesse vnderstand right well the weakenesse of Papists in my Kingdome ? Doeth not his Holinesse neuerthelesse animate my Papists to rebellion, and forbid my Papists to take the Oath of Allegiance ? Doeth not his Holinesse by this meanes draw (so much as in him lyeth) persecution vpon the backes of my Papists as vpon rebels, and expose their life as it were vpon the open stall, to be sold at a very easie price ? All these examples, either ioynt or seuerall, are manifest and euident proofes, that feare to draw mischiefe and persecution vpon the Church, hath not barred the Popes from thundering against Emperours and Kings, when- soeuer they conceiued any hope, by their fulminations to aduance their greatnesse.

Last of all; I referred the matter to the most possessed with preiudice, euen the very aduersaries, whether this doctrine, by which people are trained vp in subiection vnto Infidel or hereticall Kings, vntill the subiects be of sufficient strength to mate their Kings, to expell their Kings, and to depose them from their Kingdomes, doth not incense the Turkish Emperours and other Infidell Princes to roote outall the Christians that drawe in their yoke, as people that waite onely for a fit occasion to rebell, and to take themselues ingaged for obedience to their Lords, onely by constraint and seruile feare. Let vs therefore now conclude with Ozius,Apud Athan. in Epist. ad solitar. vitam agentes. in that famous Epistle speaking to Constantius an Arrian heretike: As hee that by secret practise or open violence would bereaue thee of thy Empire, should violate Gods ordinance: so bee thou touched with feare, least, by vsurping authoritie ouer Church matters, thou tumble not headlong into some hainous crime. Where this holy Bishop hath not vouchsafed to insert and mention the L. Cardinals excep- tion; to wit, the right of the Church alwaies excepted and saued, when she shall be of sufficient strength to shake off the yoke of Emperours. Neither speaks the same holy Bishop of priuate persons alone, or men of some particular condition and calling; but hee setteth downe a generall rule for all degrees, neuer to impeach imperial Maiesties upon any pretext whatsoever.

As his Lordships first reason drawne from weakenesse is exceeding weake: so is thatwhich the L. CardinallPag. 77. takes vp in the next place: He tellethvs there is very great difference betweene Pagan Emperours, and Christian Princes: Pagan Emperours who neuer did homage to Christ, who neuer were by their subiects receiued, with condition to acknowledge perpetuall subiection vnto the Empire of Christ; who neuer were bound by oath and mutuall contract between Prince and subiect. Christian Princes who slide backe by Apostasie, degenerate by Arrianisme, or fall away by Mahometisme. Touching the latter of these two, (as his Lordshippe saith) If they shall as it were take an oath, and make a vowe contrary to their first oath and vow made and taken when they were installed, and contrary to the condition vnder which they receiued the Scepter of their Fathers; if they withall shall turne persecutors of the Catholike re- ligion; touching these I say, the L. Cardinal holds, that without question they may bee remooued from their Kingdomes: He telleth vs not by whom, but euery where he meaneth by the Pope. Touching Kings deposed by the Pope vnder pretence of stupidity, as Childeric; or of matrimoniall causes, as Philip I. or for collating of benefices, as Philip the Faire; not one word: By that point he easily glideth, and shuffles it vp in silence, for feare of distasting the Pope on the one side, or his auditors on the other.

Now in alledging this reason, his Lordship makes all the world a witnes, that in deposing of Kings, the Pope hath no eye of regard to the benefit and securitie of the Church: For such Princes as neuer suckt other milke then that of Infidelitie and persecution of Religion, are no lesse noisome and pernicious vermin to the Church, then if they had sucked of the Churches breasts. And as for the great- nesse of the sinne or offence, it seemes to me there is very little difference in the matter. For a Prince that neuer did sweare any religious obedience to IESUS Christ, is bound no lesse to such obedience, then if he had taken a solemne oath: As the sonne that rebelliously stands vp against his father, is in equall degree of sinne, whether he hath sworne or not sworne obedience to his father; because he is bound to such obedience, not by any voluntarie contract or couenant, but by the law of Nature. The commaundement of God to kisse the Sonne, whom the Father hath confirmed and ratified King of Kings, doeth equally bind all Kings, as well Pagans as Christians. On the other side, who denies, who doubts, that Constantius Emperour at his first steppe or entrance into the Empire, did not sweare and bind himselfe by solemne vowe, to keepe the rules and to maintaine the precepts of the Orthodox faith, or that he did not receiue his fathers Empire vpon such condition? This notwithstanding, the Bishop of Rome pulled not Constantius from his Imperiall throne, but Constantius remooued the Bishop of Rome from his Papall See. And were it so, that an oath taken by a King at his consecration, and after violated, is a sufficient cause for the Pope to depose an Apostate or hereticall Prince; then by good consequence the Pope may in like sort depose a King, who beeing neither dead in Apostasie, nor sicke of Heresie, doeth neglect onely the due administration of iustice to his loyall subiects: For his oath taken at consecration importeth likewise, that he shall minister iustice to his people. A point wherein the holy Father is held short by the L. Cardinall, who dares prescribe new lawes to the Pope, and presumes to limit his fulnesse of power, within certaine meeres and head-lands, extending the Popes power only to the deposing of Christian Kings, when they turne Apostats forsaking the Catholike faith; and not such Princes as neuer breathed any thing but pure Paganisme, and neuer serued vnder the colours of Iesus Christ. Meanewhile his Lordship forgets, that King Attabaliba was deposed by the Pope from his King- dome of Peru, and the said Kingdome was conferred vpon the King of Spaine, though the said King of Peru never forsook his heathen superstition; and though the turning of him out of his terrestriall Kingdome was no way to conuert him vnto the faith of Christ. Yea his Lordship Pag. 77. a little after telleth vs himselfe, that Be the Turkes possession in the conquests that he maketh ouer Christians neuer so auncient, yet by no long tract of time whatsoeuer, can he gaine so much as a thumbes breadth of prescription: that is to say, the Turke for all that is but a disseisor, one that violently and wilfully keeps an other man from his owne, and by good right may be dispossessed of the same: whereas notwithstanding the Turkish Em- perours neuer fauoured nor sauoured Christianitie. Let vs runne ouer the ex- amples of Kings whom the Pope hath dared and presumed to depose; and hardly will any one be found, of whom it may be trewly auouched, that he hath taken an oath contrary to his oath of subiection to Iesus Christ, or that he hath wilfully cast himselfe into Apostaticall defection.

And certes to any man that weighs the matter with due consideration, it wil be found apparently false, that Kings of France haue bene receiued of their sub- iects at any time, with condition to serue IESVS CHRIST. They were actually Kings before they came forth to the solemnitie of their sacring, before they vsed any stipulation or promise to their subiects. For in hereditary kingdoms, (nothing more certaine, nothing more vncontrouleable) the Kings death in- stantly maketh liuery and seisin of the Royaltie, to his next successour. Nor is it materiall to replie, that a King succeeding by right of inheritance, takes an oath in the person of his predecessor. For euery oath is personall, proper to the person by whom it is taken: and to God no liuing creature can sweare, that his owne sonne or his heire shall proue an honest man. Well may the father, and with great solemnitie, promise that he will exhort his heire apparant with all his power and the best of his endeauours, to feare God and to practise piety. If the fathers oath be agreeable to the dueties of godlinesse, the sonne is bound thereby, whether he take an oath, or take none. On the other side, if the fathers oath come from the puddles of impietie, the sonne is bound thereby to goe the contrary way. If the fathers oath concerne things of indifferent nature, and such as by the variety or change of times, become either pernicious or impossible; then it is free for the Kings next successor and heire, prudently to fit and proportion his Lawes vnto the times present, and to the best benefit of the Common-wealth.

When I call these things to mind with some attention, I am out of all doubt, his Lordship is very much to seeke, in the right sense and nature of his Kings oath taken at his Coronation, to defend the Church, and to perseuere in the Catholike faith: For what is more vnlike and lesse credible then this conceit, that after Clouis had reigned 15. yeeres in the state of Paganisme, and then receiued holy Baptisme, he should become Christian vpon this condition, That in case hee should afterward reuolt from the Faith, it should then bee in the power of the Church, to turne him out of his Kingdome ? But had any such conditionall stipulation beene made by Clouis, in very good earnest and trewth; yet would hee neuer haue intended, that his deposing should bee the acte of the Romane Bishop, but rather of those (whether Peeres or people, or whole body of the State) by whom he had bene aduanced to the Kingdome. Let vs heare the trewth, and this is the trewth: It is farre from the customary vse in France, for their Kings to take any such oath, or to vse any such stipulation with their subiects. If any King or Prince wheresoeuer, doth vse an oath or solemne promise in these ex- presse termes, Let me lose my Kingdome, or my life, be that day my last both for life and reigne, when I shall first reuolt from the Christian Religion: By these words he calleth vpon God for vengeance, hee vseth imprecation against his owne head: but hee makes not his Crowne to stoupe by this meanes to any power in the Pope, or in the Church, or in the people.

And touching inscriptions vpon coynes, of which point his Lordship speaketh by the way; verely the nature of the money or coine (the stamping and minting whereof is one of the marks of the Prince his dignity and Soueraignty) is not changed by bearing the letters of Christ Name on the reuerse or on the front. Such characters of Christs Name, are aduertisements and instructions to the people, that in shewing and yeelding obedience vnto the King, they are obedient vnto the King, they are obedient vnto Christ; & those Princes likewise, who are so wel aduised, to haue the most sacred Names inscribed and printed in their coines, doe take and acknowledge Iesus Christ for supreme King of Kings. The said holy characters are no representation or profession, that any Kings Crowne dependeth vpon the Church, or can be taken away by the Pope. The L. Cardinal indeed so beareth vs in hand. But he inuerts the words of Iesus Christ, and wrings them out of the right ioynt: For Christ without all ambiguitie and circum- locution, by the image and inscription of the money, doeth directly and expressely prooue Caesar to bee free from subiection, and entirely Soueraigne. Now if such a supreme and Soueraigne Prince, at any time shall bandie and combine against God, and thereby shall become a rebellious and perfidious Prince; doubtless for such disloyaltie he shall deserue, that God would take from him all hope of life eternall: and yet hereby neither Pope nor people hath reason to bee puft vp, in their power to depriue him of his temporall Kingdome.

The L. Cardinall Page 76. saith besides; The champions of the Popes power to depose Kings, doe expound that commandement of S. Paul, whereby euery soule is made sub- iect vnto the superiour powers, to bee a prouisionall precept or caution accommodated to the times; and to stand in force, onely vntill the Church were growen in strength vn- to such a scantling, that it might be in the power of the faithfull, without shaking the pillars of Christian state, to stand in the breach, and cautelosly to prouide that none but Christian Princes might be receiued; according to the Law in Deut. Thou shalt make thee a King from among thy brethren. The reason whereupon they ground, is this: Because Paul saith, It is a shame for Christians to be iudged vnder vniust Infidels, in matters or businesse, which they had one against another: For which inconuenience, Iustinian after prouided by Law; when hee ordeined that no Infidel nor Heretike might be admitted to the administration of iustice in the Common-wealth.

In which words of the Cardinall, the word Receiued, is to bee obserued espe- cially and aboue the rest: For by chopping in that word, hee doeth nimbly and with a tricke of Legier demain, transforme or change the very state of the ques- tion. For the question or issue of the cause, is not about receiuing, establishing, or choosing a Prince; (as in those Nations where the Kingdome goes by election) but about doing homage to the Prince, when God hath setled him in the King- dome, and hath cast it vpon a Prince by hereditary succession: For that which is written, Thou shalt make thee a King, doeth no way concerne and touch the people of France in these dayes: because the making of their King hath not of long time been tyed to their election. The passage therefore in Deuter. makes nothing to the purpose; no more then doth Iustinians law: For it is our free and voluntary confession, that a Christian Prince is to haue speciall care of the Lawes, and to prouide that no vnbeleeuer be made Lord Chiefe-Iustice of the Land, that no Infidel be put in trust with administration of Iustice to the people. But here the issue doeth not direct vs to speake of Delegates, of subordinate Magistrates, and such as are in Commission from the Prince, but of the supreame Prince himselfe, the Soueraigne Magistrate ordained by nature, and confirmed by succession. Our question is, whether such a Prince can be vnthroned by the Pope, by whom he was not placed in the Throne; and whether the Pope can despoile such a Prince, of that Royaltie which was neuer giuen him by the Pope, vnder any pretended colour and imputation of heresie, of stupiditie, or infringing the priuiledges of Monaste- ries, or transgressing the Lawes and lines of holy Matrimonie.

Now that S. Pauls commandement which bindeth euery soule in the bands of subiection vnto the higher powers, is no precept giuen by way of prouiso, and onely to serue the times, but a standing and a perpetuall rule, it is hereby more than manifest. S. Paul hath grounded this commandement vpon certaine rea- sons, not onely constant and permanent by their proper nature, but likewise necessary for euery state, condition, and reuolution of the times. His reasons; Because all powers are ordained of God: because resisting of powers is resisting the ordinance of God: because the Magistrate beares the sword to execute iustice: because obedience and subiection to the Magistrate is necessary, not onely for feare of his wrath, or feare of punishment, but also for conscience sake. It is therefore a case grounded vpon conscience, it is not a Law deuised by humane wisedome; it is not fashionable to the qualities of the times. Apostolicall instructions for the right informing of maners, are not changeable according to times and seasons. To vse the L. Cardinals language, and to follow his fancie in the matter, is to make way for two pestiferous mischiefes: First, let it be free and lawfull for Christians, to hold the commanding rules of GOD for prouisionall cautions, and what followes ? Men are ledde into the broad way of impietie, and the whole Scripture is wiped of all authoritie. Then againe, for the other mischiefe: The glorious triumphes of most blessed Martyrs in their vnspeakable torments and sufferings, by the L. Car- dinals position shall bee iudged vnworthy to weare the title and Crowne of Mar- tyrdome. How so ? Because (according to his new fiction) they haue giuen place to the violence and furie of heathen Magistrates, not in obedience to the necessary and certaine Commandement of God, but rather to a prouisionall direction, ac- commodated to the humours of the times. And therfore the L. Cardinal hath vsed none other clay wherewith to dawbe ouer his deuise, but plaine falsification of holy Scripture: For he makes the Apostle say to the Corinthians, It is a shame for Christians to bee iudged vnder vnbeleeuing Magistrates; whereas in that whole context of Paul, there is no such matter. For when the Apostle saith, I speake it euen to your shame; pro\s e)ntroph\n de/gw. he doeth not say it is a shame for a beleeuer to be iudged vnder an Infidel, but he makes them ashamed of their vngodly course, and vn- christian practise, that in suing and impleading one another, they layd their actions of contention in the Courts of vnbeleeuing Iudges. The shame was not in bearing that yoke which God had charged their necks withall, but in deuouring and eating vp one an other with Writs of habeas corpus, and with other Processes; as also in vncouering the shame, in laying open the shamefull parts and prankes played by Christians, before Infidels, to the great scandall of the Church. Here I say the L. Cardinall is taken in a tricke of manifest falsification. If therefore a King when he falls to play the heretike, deserueth to be deposed; why should not a Cardinall when he falls to play the iuggler with holy Scripture, deserue to be disrobed ?

Meane while the indifferent Reader is to consider, how greatly this doctrine is preiudicial, and how full of danger, to Christians liuing vnder hereticall or Pagan Princes. For make it once knowne to the Emperour of Turkes, let him once get neuer so little a smacke of this doctrine; that Christians liuing vnder his Empire doe take Gods commandement, for obedience to Princes whom they count In- fidels, to be onely a prouisional precept for a time, and wait euery houre for all occasions to shake off the yoke of his bondage; doubtlesse he will neuer spare with all speed to roote the whole stocke, with all the armes and branches of Christians out of his dominions. Adde hereunto the L. Cardinals former determination; that possession kept neuer so long by the Turke in his Conquests ouer Christians, gaines him not by so long tract of time one inch of prescription; and it will appear, that his Lordship puts the Turkish Emperour in minde, and by his in- struction leades the said Emperour as it were by the hand, to haue no maner of affiance in his Christian subiects; and withall to afflict his poore Christians with all sorts of most grieuous and cruell torments. In this regard the poore Christians of Grecia and Syria, must needs be very little beholden to his Lordship. As for my selfe, and my Popish Subiects, to whom 1 am no lesse then an heretike for- sooth am not I by this doctrine of the Cardinall, pricked and whetted against my naturall inclination, to turne clemencie into rigour; seeing that by his doctrine my subiects are made to beleeue, they owe me subiection onely by way of prouiso, and with waiting the occasion to worke my vtter destruction and finall ruine; the rather, because Turkes, miscreants, and heretikes are marshalled by the Cardinall in the same ranke; and heretikes are counted worse, yea more iustly deposeable, then Turkes and Infidels, as irreligious breakers and violaters of their oath ? Who seeth not here how great indignitie is offered to me a Christian King, paral- leled with Infidels, reputed worse then a Turke, taken for an vsurper of my King- domes, reckoned a Prince, to whom subiects owe a forced obedience by way of prouision, vntill they shall haue meanes to shake off the yoke, and to bare my temples of the Crowne, which neuer can be pulled from the sacred Head, but with losse of the head it selfe ?

Touching the warres vndertaken by the French, English, and Germaines, in their expedition for Ierusalem, it appeares by the issue and euent of the said warres, that God approoued them not for honourable. That expedition was a deuise and inuention of the Pope, whereby he might come to be infeoffed in the Kingdomes of Christian Princes.. For then all such of the French, English, or Germaines, as vndertooke the Croisade, became the Popes meere vassals. Then all robbers by the high way side, adulterers, cutthroats, and base bankerupts, were exempted from the Secular and Ciuill power, their causes were sped in Con- sistorian Courts, so soone as they had gotten the Crosse on their cassocks or coat- armours, and had vowed to serue in the expedition for the Leuant. Then for the Popes pleasure and at his commaundement, whole countryes were emptied of their Nobles and common souldiers. Then they made long marches into the Leuant: For what purpose ? Onely to die vpon the points of the Saracens pikes, or by the edge of their barbarous courtelasses, battle-axes, fauchions, and other weapons, without any benefit and aduantage to themselues or others. Then the Nobles were driuen to sell their goodly Mannors, and auncient demaines to the Church-men, at vnder prises and low rates; the very roote from which a great part of the Church and Church-mens reuenewes hath sprung and growne to so great height. Then, to be short, his most bountifull Holiness See the Bull of Innoc. 3. at the end of the Latter. Conc. gaue to any of the riffe-raffe-rank, that would vndertake this expedition into the Holy land, a free and full pardon for all his sinnes, besides a degree of glory aboue the vulgar in the Celestial Paradise. Military vertue, I confesse, is commendable and honourable; prouided it bee employed for iustice, and that generous noblenesse of valiant spirits bee not vnder a colour and shadow of piety, fetcht ouer with some casts or deuises of Italian cunning.

Now let vs obserue the wisedome of the Lord Cardinall through this whole discourse. His Lordship is pleased in his Oration, to cite certaine few passages of Scripture, culls and picks them out for the most gracefull in shewe: leues out of his whole troupes of honourable witnesses, vpon whose testimonie, the Popes themselues and their principall adherents doe build his power to depose Kings, and to giue order for all Temporall causes. Take a sight of their best and most honourable witnesses. Peter said to Christ, See here two swords; and Christ answered, It is sufficient. Christ said to Peter, Put vp thy sword into thy sheath. God said to Ieremie,Ier. 1. I haue established thee ouer Nations and Kingdomes. Paul1. Cor. 21. said to the Corinthians, The spirituall man discerneth all things. Christ said to his Apostles, Whatsoeuer yee shall loose vpon earth: by which words the Pope hath power forsooth to loose the oath of allegiance. Moses said, In the beginning God created the heauen and the earth. Vpon these passages, Pope Boniface 8. grapling and tugging with Philip the Faire, doth build his Temporall power.Extrauag. Vnam Sanctam. Other Popes and Papists auouch the like authorities. Christ said of himself, All things are giuen to me of my Father, and all power is giuen vnto me in heauen and in earth. The Deuils said, If thou cast vs out, send vs into this herd of swine. Christ said to his Disciples, Yee shall finde the colt of an asse bound, loose it and bring it vnto me. By these places the aduersaries prooue, that Christ disposed of Temporall matters; and inferre thereupon, why not Christs Vicar as well as Christ himselfe. The places and testimonies now following are very expresse: In stead of thy fathers shall be thy children: thou shalt make them Princes through all the earth.Psal. 45. Item, Iesus Christ not onely commaunded Peter to feed his lambs; but said also to Peter, Arise, kill, and eat:Ioh. 12 [21]. the pleasant glosse, the rare inuention of the L. Cardinall Baronius. Christ said to the people, If I were lift vpfrom the earth, I will draw all things vnto me. Who lets, what hinders this place from fitting the Pope ? Paul said to the Corinthians, Know ye not that we shall iudge the Angels ? how much more then the things that pertaine vnto this life ? A little after, Haue not we power to eate ? These are the chiefe passages, on which as vpon maine arches, the roofe of Papall Monarchie, concerning Temporall causes, hath rested for three or foure aages past. And yet his Lordship durst not repose any confidence in their firme standing to beare vp the said roofe of Temporall Monarchie, for feare of making his auditors to burst with laughter. A wise part without question, if his Lordship hath not defiled his lips before, with a more ridiculous argument drawne from the leprosie and drie scab.

Let vs now by way of comparison behold Iesus Christ paying tribute vnto Caesar, and the Pope making Caesar to pay him tribute: Iesus Christ perswading the Iewes to pay tribute vnto an heathen Emperour, and the Pope dispending with subiects for their obedience to Christian Emperours: Iesus Christ refusing to arbitrate a controuersie of inheritance partable betweene two priuate parties, and the Pope thrusting in himselfe without warrant or Commission to bee absolute Iudge in the deposing of Kings: Iesus Christ professing that his Kingdome is not of this world, and the Pope establishing himselfe in a terrene Empire. In like manner the Apostles forsaking all their goods to followe Christ, and the Pope robbing Christians of their goods; the Apostles persecuted by Pagan Emperours, and the Pope now setting his foote on the very throate of Christian Emperours, then proudly treading Imperiall Crownes vnder his feete. By this comparison, the L. Cardinalls allegation of Scripture in fauour of his Master the Pope, is but a kind of puppet-play, to make Iesus Christ a mocking stocke, rather then to satisfie his auditors with any sound precepts and wholesome instructions. Hereof he seemeth to giue some inckling himselfe: For after he hath beene plentifull in citing authorities of Scripture, and of newe Doctors, which make for the Popes power to depose Kings; at last he comes in with a faire and open confession,Pag. 85. that neither by diuine Oracles, nor by honourable antiquitie, this controuersie hath beene yet determined: and so pulls downe in a word with one hand, the frame of worke that he had built and set vp before with an other; discouering withall, the reluctation and priuie checkes of his owne conscience.

There yet remaineth one obiection, the knot whereof the L. Cardinall in a maner sweateth to vntie. His words be these:Page 84. The champions for the negatiue flie to the analogie of other proceedings and practises in the Church: They affirme that priuate persons, masters or owners of goods and possesions among the common people, are not depriued of their goods for Heresie; and consequently that Princes much more should not for the same crime bee depriued of their estates. For answere to this reason, he brings in the defendants of deposition, speaking after this maner; In the Kingdome of France the strict execution of lawes decreed in Court against Here- tikes, is fauourably suspended and stopped, for the preseruation of peace and publike tranquilitie. He saith elsewhere; Conniuence is vsed towards these Heretikes in regard of their multitude, because a notable part of the French Nation and State is made all of Heretikes. I suppose that out of speciall charitie, he would haue those Here- tikes of his owne making, forewarned what courteous vse and entreaty they are to expect; when he affirmeth that execution of the lawes is but suspended: For indeed suspensions hold but for a time. But in a cause of that nature and impor- tance, I dare promise my selfe, that my most honoured brother the King of France, will make vse of other counsell: will rather seeke the amitie of his neighbour Princes, and the peace of his Kingdome: will beare in mind the great and faithfull seruice of those, who in matter of religion dissent from his Maiestie, as of the onely men that haue preserued and saued the Crowne for the King his father, of most glorious memorie. I am perswaded my brother of France wil beleeue, that his liege people pretended by the L. Cardinall to bee heretikes, are not halfe so bad as my Romane Catholike subiects, who by secret practises vndermine my life, serue a forreine Souereigne, are discharged by his Bulls of their obedience due to me their naturall Souereigne, are bound (by the maximes and rules published and maintained in fauour of the Pope, before this full and famous assemblie of the Estate at Paris; if the said maximes be of any weight and authoritie) to hold meet for no lawfull King, are there taught and instructed, that Pauls commande- ment concerning subiection vnto the higher Powers, aduerse to their professed religion, is onely a prouisionall precept, framed to the times, and watching for the opportunitie to shake off the yoake. All which notwithstanding, I deale with such Romane-Catholikes by the rules and wayes of Princely clemencie; their heinous and pernicious error, in effect no lesse then the capitall crime of high treason, I vse to call some disease or distemper of the mind. Last of all, I beleeue my said brother of France will set downe in his tables, as in record, how little hee standeth ingaged to the L. Cardinall in this behalfe: For those of the reformed Religion professe and proclaime, that next vnder God, they owe theirpreseruation and safetie to the wisedome and benignity of their Kings. But now comes the Cardinall, and he seekes to steale this perswasion out of their hearts: He tells them in open Parliament, and without any going about bushes, that all their wel- fare and securitie standeth in their multitude, and in the feare which others con- ceiue to trouble the State, by the strict execution of lawes against Heretikes.

He addeth moreouer, that In case a third Sect should peepe out and growe vp in France, the professors thereof should suffer confiscation of their goods, with losse of life it selfe; as hath bene practised at Geneua against Seruetus, and in England against Arians. My answer is this, That punishments for heretikes, duely and according to Law conuicted, are set downe by decrees of the ciuill Magistrate, bearing rule in the countrey where the said heretikes inhabite, and not by any ordinances of the Pope. I say withall, the L. Cardinall hath no reason to match and parallell the reformed Churches with Seruetus and the Arians: For those heretikes were powerfully conuicted by Gods word, and lawfully condemned by the ancient Generall Councils, where they were permitted and admitted to plead their owne cause in person. But as for the trewth professed by me, and those of the reformed Religion, it was neuer yet hissed out of the Schooles, nor cast out of any Council, (like some Parliament bills) where both sides haue bene heard with like indifferencie. Yea, what Council soeuer hath bene offered vnto vs in these latter times, it hath bene proposed with certaine presuppositions: as, That his Holinesse (beeing a partie in the cause, and consequently to come vnder iudge- ment as it were to the barre vpon his triall) shall be the Iudge of Assize with Commission of Oyer and Determiner: it shall been celebrated in a citie of no safe accesse, without safe conduct or conuoy to come or goe at pleasure, and without danger: it shall be assembled of such persons with free suffrage and voyce, as vphold this rule, (which they haue already put in practise against Iohn Hus and Hierome of Prage) that faith giuen, and oath taken to an Heretike, must not be obserued.

Now then to resume our former matter; If the Pope hitherto hath neuer pre- sumed, for pretended heresie to confiscate by sentence, either the lands or the goods of priuate persons, or common people of the French Nation, wherefore should hee dare to dispossesse Kings of their Royall thrones ? wherefore takes he more vpon him ouer Kings, then ouer priuate persons; wherefore shall the sacred heads of Kings be more churlishly, vnciuilly, and rigorously handled, then the hoods of the meanest people ? Here the L. Cardinal in stead of a direct answer, breakes out of the lists, alledging cleane from the purpose examples of heretikes punished, not by the Pope, but by the ciuill Magistrate of the Countrey: But Bellarmine speakes to the point with a more free and open heart: hee is absolute and resolute in this opinion, that his Holinesse hath plenary power to dispose all Temporall estates and matters in the whole world; I am confident (saith Bellar- mine Contr. Barclaium, cap. 27.) and I speake it with assurance, that our Lord Iesus Christ in the dayes of his mortalitie, had power to dispose of all Temporall things yea, to strip Souereigne Kings and absolute Lords of their Kingdomes and Seignories: and without all doubt hath granted and left euen the same power vnto his Vicar, to make vse thereof when- soeuer hee shall thinke it necessary for the saluation of soules. And so his Lordship speaketh without exception of any thing at all: For who doth not know, that lesus Christ had power to dispose no lesse of priuate mens possessions, then of whole Realmes and Kingdomes at his pleasure, if it had beene his pleasure to display the ensignes of his power ? The same fulnesse of power is likewise in the Pope. In good time: belike his Holinesse is the sole heire of Christ, in whole and in part. The last Lateran Council Sess. 9. fineth a Laic that speaketh blasphemie, for the first offence (if he be a gentleman) at 25. ducats, and at 50. for the second. It presupposeth and taketh it for graunted, that the Church may rifle and ran- sacke the purses of priuate men, and cast lots for their goods. The Councill of Trent diggeth as deepe for the same veine of gold and siluer. It ordaines; Sess. 25. cap. 19. That Emperours, Kings, Dukes, Princes, and Lords of cities, castles, and territories hold- ing of the Church, in case they shall. assigne any place within their limits or liberties for the duell betweene two Christians, shall be depriued of the said citie, castle, or place, where such duell shall be performed, they holding the said place of the Church by any kind of tenure: that all other Estates held in fee where the like offence shall be committed, shall forthwith fall and become forfeited to their immediate and next Lords: that all goods, possessions, and estates, as well of the combatants themselues, as of their seconds shall bee confiscate. This Councill doeth necessarily presuppose, it lieth in the hand and power of the Church, to dispose of all the lands and estates, held in fee throughout all Christendome; (because the Church forsooth can take from one, and giue vnto an other all estates held in fee whatsoeuer, as well such as hold of the Church, as of secular Lords) and to make ordinances for the confisca- tion of all priuate persons goods. By this Canon the Kingdome of Naples hath need to looke well vnto it selfe. For one duell it may fall into the Exchecquer of the Romane Church; because that Kingdome payeth a Reliefe to the Church, as a Royaltie or Seignorie that holdeth in fee of the said Church. And in France there is not one Lordship, not one Mannor, not one farme which the Pope by this meanes cannot shift ouer to a new Lord. His Lordship therefore had carried him- selfe and the cause much better, if in stead of seeking such idle shifts, he had by a more large assertion maintained the Popes power to dispose of priuate mens possessions, with no lesse right and authoritie then of Kingdomes: For what colour of reason can bee giuen, for making the Pope Lord of the whole, and not of the parts ? for making him Lord of the forrest in grosse, and not of the trees in parcell ? for making him Lord of the whole house, and not of the parlour or the dining chamber ?

His Lordship alleadgeth yet an other reason, but of no better weight: Betweene the power of priuate owners ouer their goods, and the power of Kings ouer their estates, there is no little difference: For the goods of priuate persons are ordained for their owners, and Princes for the benefit of their Common-wealths. Heare me now answere. If this Cardinal-reason hath any force to inferre, that a King may law- fully be depriued of his Kingdome for heresie, but a priuate person cannot for the same crime be turned out of his mansion house; then it shall follow by the same reason, that a Father for the same cause may bee depriued of all power ouer his children, but a priuate owner cannot be depriued of his goods in the like case: because goods are ordeined for the benefit and comfort of their owners, but fathers are ordeined for the good and benefit of their children: But most certain it is, that Kings representing the image of God in earth and Gods place, haue better and closer seate in their chaires of Estate, then any priuate persons haue in the saddle of their inheritances and patrimonies, which are dayly seene for sleight causes, to flit and to fall into the hands of new Lords: Whereas a Prince being the Head, cannot bee loosed in the proper ioynt, not dismounted; like a cannon when the carriage thereof is vnlockt, without a sore shaking and a most grieuous disloca- tion of all the members, yea, without subuerting the whole bodie of the State, whereby priuate persons without number are inwrapped together in the same ruine; euen as the lower shrubs and other brush-wood are crushed in pieces alto- gether by the fall of a great oake. But suppose his Lordships reason were some- what ponderous and solide withall, yet a King (which would not bee forgotten) is endowed not onely with the Kingdome, but also with the ancient Desmenes and Crowne-lands, for which none can be so simple to say, The King was ordeined and created King; which neuerthelesse he loseth when hee loseth his Crowne. Admit againe this reason were of some pith, to make mighty Kings more easily de- poseable then priuate persons from their patrimonies; yet all this makes nothing for the deriuing and fetching of deposition from the Popes Consistorie. What hee neuer conferred, by what right or power can he claime to take away ?

But see heere no doubt a sharpe and subtile difference put by the L. Cardinall betweene a Kingdome, and the goods of priuate persons. Goods, as his Lordship saith, are without life: they can be constrained by no force, by no example, by no inducement of their owners to lose eternall life: Subiects by their Princes may. Now I am of the contrary beliefe, That an hereticall owner, or master of a family, hath greater power and meanes withall, to seduce his owne seruants and children, then a Prince hath to peruert his own subiects; and yet for the contagion of Heresie, and for corrupt religion, children are not remoued from their parents, nor seruants are taken away from their masters. Histories abound with examples of most flourishing Churches, vnder a Prince of contrary religion. And if things without life or soule are with lesse danger left in an heretikes hands; why then shall not an hereticall King with more facilitie and lesse danger keepe his Crowne, his Royall charge, his lands, his customes, his imposts, &c ? For will any man, except he bee out of his wits, affirme these things to haue any life or soule ? Or why shall it bee counted folly to leaue a sword in the hand of a mad Bedlam ? Is not a sword also without life and soule ? For my part, I should rather be of this minde; that possession of things without reason, is more dangerous and pernicious in the hands of an euill master, then the possession of things endued with life and reason: For things without life lacke both reason and iudgment, how to exempt and free themselues from being instruments in euill and wicked actions, from being emploied to vngodly and abominable vses. I will not deny, that an hereti- call Prince is a plague, a pernicious and mortall sickenesse to the soules of his subiects: But a breach made by one mischiefe, must not bee filled vp with a greater inconuenience: An errour must not be shocked and shouldered with disloialtie, not heresie with periurie, not impietie with sedition and armed rebel- lion against GOD and the King. GOD, who vseth to try and to schoole his Church, will neuer forsake his Church; nor hath need to protect his Church by any pro- ditorious and prodigious practises of perfidious Christians: For he makes his Church to be like the burning bush: In the middest of the fire and flames of per- secutions, hee will prouide that she shall not be consumed, because hee standeth in the midst of his Church. And suppose there may be some iust cause for the French, to play the rebels against their King; yet will it not follow, that such rebellious motions are to be raised by the bellowes of the Romane Bishop, to whose Pastorall charge and office it is nothing proper, to intermeddle in the ciuill affaires of forraine Kingdomes.

Here is the summe and substance of the L. Cardinals whole discourse, touching his pretence of the second inconuenience. Which discourse hee hath closed with a remarkeable confession: to wit, that neither by the authoritie of holy Scripture, nor by the the testimonie and verdict of the Primitiue Church, there hath bene any full decision of this question. In regard whereof he falleth into admiration, that Lay-people haue gone so farre in audaciousnesse, as to labour that a doubt- full doctrine might for euer passe currant, and be taken for a new article of faith. What a shame, what a reproach is this ? how full of scandall ? for so his Lordship is pleased to cry out. This breakes into the seueralls and inclosures of the Churche: this lets in whole herds of heresies to grase in her greene and sweet pastures. On the other side, without any such Rhetoricall outcries, I simply affirme: It is a re- proach, a scandall, a crime of rebellion, for a subiect hauing his full charge and loade of benefits, in the new spring of his Kings tender aage, his King-fathers blood yet reeking, and vpon the point of an addresse for a double match with Spaine; in so honourable an assembly, to seeke the thraldome of his Kings Crowne, to play the captious in cauilling about causes of his Kings deposing, to giue his former life the Lye with shame enough in his old aage, and to make him- selfe a common by-word, vnder the name of a Problematicall Martyr; one that offers himselfe to fagot and fire, for a point of doctrine but problematically handled, that is, distrustfully and onely by way of doubtfull and questionable dis- course: yea for a point of doctrine, in which the French (as he pretendeth) are permitted to thwart and crosse his Holines in iudgement, prouided they speake in it as in a point, not certaine and necessary, but onely doubtfull and probable.